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May 4, 2008 at 3:44 am #28295chi ballerParticipant
Hi,
A question on packing breathing!
How many times can one do packing breathing without hurting your internal organs, is there a risk?
regards
ChiballerMay 4, 2008 at 1:45 pm #28296Swedich DragonParticipantHello Chi baller
There are some greate risk in this practise if you not are careful. I myself is on my way to learn it this summer. Have just tried it a litle bit jet.
You can do the packing no more than 3 times a day to begin with and increase slowly ower time.
The most risk in this practise is to go ower your limit. Do the breathing to about maximum 80 % of your maximum capacity. Then what is 80% in the future is much more than your full today. Let the breathing be easy and not force anything! (Important)
Learn the details and be careful with this practise.
The practise was taken away from the Universal tao practises some years ago beacase many students get some serious problems with it. That is the reason why I haven´t learned it jet, my teachers don´t teach it.
Look at the bottom of this webpage http://alchemicaltaoism.com/ at the iron shirt 1.
Also look at the bottom on the iron shirt 1 page and klick at the link:Resources for Gentler Alternatives to Packing BreathingGood luck and be careful
S D
May 5, 2008 at 1:36 am #28298chi ballerParticipantHi SD
What was some of the dangers from it also if someone does it correctly and can pack it what else happens as in positive results.
CB
May 5, 2008 at 8:31 am #28300Michael WinnKeymasterFunny you should ask that question – just as I was about to post this article. synchronicity….Read my piece on Pulsation Packing – gentle alternative to Iron shirt. It may be the article posted also on Alchemical Taoism site, not sure. I teach a different method at the Greater Kan and Li, called sun-moon breathing, that involves inhale-only method coupled with alchemical cooking. – Michael
HOW DAVID BLAINE HELD HIS BREATH
By Tiffany Sharples
Time
Thursday, May 1, 2008http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1736834,00.html
For most non-medical people, the term “apnea” is most familiar when coupled
with the word “sleep,” and refers to a dangerous condition in which people
inadvertently stop breathing while asleep. But the word literally means a
temporary cessation of breathing and it is practiced (on purpose) around the
world by an international community of extreme athletes — a brotherhood
that now includes magician and stuntman David Blaine. On the set of The
Oprah Winfrey Show on April 30, Blaine broke the world record by holding his
breath for 17 minutes and 4 seconds — proving that just how temporary apnea
can be is a question of training, endurance and will.An average person in good health can hold their breath for about two
minutes, but with even small amounts of practice it is possible to increase
that time dramatically. “The body can be trained,” explains Dr. Ralph
Potkin, a pulmonary specialist who worked with Blaine in the weeks leading
up to his recent feat.When you deprive your body of oxygen, it is only a matter of time before
your carbon dioxide levels build, triggering a reflex that will cause your
breathing muscles — including the diaphragm and the muscles between the
ribs — to spasm. The pain of these spasms is what causes most people to
gulp for breath after just a couple of minutes. When holding your breath
underwater, however, you have a bit of mammalian evolution on your side.
When humans are submerged in cold water, our bodies instinctively prepare to
conserve oxygen, much in the way that dolphins’ and whales’ bodies do when
they dive. “Heart rate drops, blood pressure goes up and circulation gets
redistributed,” Potkin says. The body’s focus becomes getting the oxygenated
blood primarily to the vital organs — the brain and the heart — and not
the extremities or abdomen.This reflex can help us conserve the oxygen we do have, but it doesn’t do
much for the painful muscle spasms. Overcoming those is a matter of
concentration and meditation. “This is one of those Zen sports,” Potkin
explains.Suppressing the powerful pain impulse too successfully can prove deadly:
subjects can continue holding their breath up to the point that their brains
shut down from lack of oxygen. If you’re 100 feet under water — or even
three feet underwater in a pool — it’s not a good time to pass out. In
order to break the world record, Blaine had to hold his breath without
fainting. (Had he continued until he’d depleted his brain’s oxygen, however,
Potkin is convinced he could have gone for another full minute.)That of course, is down to months of rigorous training, including practicing
a technique called glossopharyngeal insufflation, or lung packing. In order
to maximize the amount of air taken into the lungs before apnea, Blaine,
among other divers, inhaled until his lungs were filled to their
physiological capacity, and then forced additional air into the lungs by
swallowing, hard. Using this technique, Blaine was able to cram another
quart’s worth of air into his already full lungs, Potkin estimates. (He also
fasted before before the actual record breaking act, in order to have more
room for his lungs to expand without bumping up against a full stomach.) In
a study of five elite free divers, who descend to scuba-diving depths
without the aid of equipment, Potkin found that the lung packing was
“associated with deeper dives and longer holding times.”Of course, another factor associated with longer holding times is the
consumption of pure oxygen beforehand. The world record for holding your
breath after inhaling pure oxygen is now Blaine’s — 17 minutes and 4
seconds. The record without the pure oxygen, which Blaine failed to break
during an attempt last year in Manhattan’s Lincoln Center, is 8 minutes and
58 seconds.With or without pure oxygen, holding your breath is a difficult and
dangerous pasttime even for elite athletes. When not done carefully, it can
lead to drowning, or to potential tissue damage in the heart, brains or
lungs. Preliminary results from Potkin’s research into apnea’s long-term
effects show some abnormal brain scans among young, extreme free divers.
There’s still much to learn about the phenomenon; as a medical student,
Potkin recalls, he was told that no one could hold his breath for more than
five minutes without suffering brain damage. Now, he wants to see if the
technique can be used for medical purposes — and he’s hoping Blaine’s
latest stunt provides the impetus for a greater scientific understanding of
how to hold one’s breath.May 5, 2008 at 8:31 am #28302Michael WinnKeymasterFunny you should ask that question – just as I was about to post this article. synchronicity….Read my piece on Pulsation Packing – gentle alternative to Iron shirt. It may be the article posted also on Alchemical Taoism site, not sure. I teach a different method at the Greater Kan and Li, called sun-moon breathing, that involves inhale-only method coupled with alchemical cooking. – Michael
HOW DAVID BLAINE HELD HIS BREATH
By Tiffany Sharples
Time
Thursday, May 1, 2008http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1736834,00.html
For most non-medical people, the term “apnea” is most familiar when coupled
with the word “sleep,” and refers to a dangerous condition in which people
inadvertently stop breathing while asleep. But the word literally means a
temporary cessation of breathing and it is practiced (on purpose) around the
world by an international community of extreme athletes — a brotherhood
that now includes magician and stuntman David Blaine. On the set of The
Oprah Winfrey Show on April 30, Blaine broke the world record by holding his
breath for 17 minutes and 4 seconds — proving that just how temporary apnea
can be is a question of training, endurance and will.An average person in good health can hold their breath for about two
minutes, but with even small amounts of practice it is possible to increase
that time dramatically. “The body can be trained,” explains Dr. Ralph
Potkin, a pulmonary specialist who worked with Blaine in the weeks leading
up to his recent feat.When you deprive your body of oxygen, it is only a matter of time before
your carbon dioxide levels build, triggering a reflex that will cause your
breathing muscles — including the diaphragm and the muscles between the
ribs — to spasm. The pain of these spasms is what causes most people to
gulp for breath after just a couple of minutes. When holding your breath
underwater, however, you have a bit of mammalian evolution on your side.
When humans are submerged in cold water, our bodies instinctively prepare to
conserve oxygen, much in the way that dolphins’ and whales’ bodies do when
they dive. “Heart rate drops, blood pressure goes up and circulation gets
redistributed,” Potkin says. The body’s focus becomes getting the oxygenated
blood primarily to the vital organs — the brain and the heart — and not
the extremities or abdomen.This reflex can help us conserve the oxygen we do have, but it doesn’t do
much for the painful muscle spasms. Overcoming those is a matter of
concentration and meditation. “This is one of those Zen sports,” Potkin
explains.Suppressing the powerful pain impulse too successfully can prove deadly:
subjects can continue holding their breath up to the point that their brains
shut down from lack of oxygen. If you’re 100 feet under water — or even
three feet underwater in a pool — it’s not a good time to pass out. In
order to break the world record, Blaine had to hold his breath without
fainting. (Had he continued until he’d depleted his brain’s oxygen, however,
Potkin is convinced he could have gone for another full minute.)That of course, is down to months of rigorous training, including practicing
a technique called glossopharyngeal insufflation, or lung packing. In order
to maximize the amount of air taken into the lungs before apnea, Blaine,
among other divers, inhaled until his lungs were filled to their
physiological capacity, and then forced additional air into the lungs by
swallowing, hard. Using this technique, Blaine was able to cram another
quart’s worth of air into his already full lungs, Potkin estimates. (He also
fasted before before the actual record breaking act, in order to have more
room for his lungs to expand without bumping up against a full stomach.) In
a study of five elite free divers, who descend to scuba-diving depths
without the aid of equipment, Potkin found that the lung packing was
“associated with deeper dives and longer holding times.”Of course, another factor associated with longer holding times is the
consumption of pure oxygen beforehand. The world record for holding your
breath after inhaling pure oxygen is now Blaine’s — 17 minutes and 4
seconds. The record without the pure oxygen, which Blaine failed to break
during an attempt last year in Manhattan’s Lincoln Center, is 8 minutes and
58 seconds.With or without pure oxygen, holding your breath is a difficult and
dangerous pasttime even for elite athletes. When not done carefully, it can
lead to drowning, or to potential tissue damage in the heart, brains or
lungs. Preliminary results from Potkin’s research into apnea’s long-term
effects show some abnormal brain scans among young, extreme free divers.
There’s still much to learn about the phenomenon; as a medical student,
Potkin recalls, he was told that no one could hold his breath for more than
five minutes without suffering brain damage. Now, he wants to see if the
technique can be used for medical purposes — and he’s hoping Blaine’s
latest stunt provides the impetus for a greater scientific understanding of
how to hold one’s breath.May 5, 2008 at 2:02 pm #28304Swedich DragonParticipantI don´t know if you saw it but there was some of the dangers mentioned in the webside.
“packing-breathing very aggressively on his own for a period of at least some weeks, incurred injury (temporarily impaired vision, anxiety, dizziness) and was seeking remedial help.”
benefits: Increase the chi pressure inside the organs. The body will be more streangthen and not hurt if kiked in martial arts or the like. The body will also root better I think. Increased chi pressure also helpes the body to be more aligned and you will also have more energy to use in your daily life.
This is how I see it. More evolved persons might know much more of it than I do.
With regards S D
May 7, 2008 at 12:38 am #28306chi ballerParticipantPacking the chi in the dan tian for 8 minutes would give you some internal power!
What about Dynamic tension and packing like hung gar and southern shaolin arts?
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