Home › Forum Online Discussion › General › water gate, fire gate and inner alchemy of Kumar lineage
- This topic has 2 replies, 2 voices, and was last updated 19 years, 10 months ago by Jernej.
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January 10, 2005 at 9:52 am #2528JernejParticipant
Kumar should not name his teaching water way.
It is water gate way of his lineage.
Steps:
1.water gate
-outer dissolving (break the energy pattern form)
-inner dissolving (shift the energy pattern)
gate is passed when one passes ‘the dark night of soul’
then one proceeds to…
2.inner alchemy
-sound vibrations/visualization
-moving cauldron along the central channel
-including stars, planets
-developing inner senses
-kan and li meditationsThe fire gate way in his lineage:
1.fire gate
-ignite the fire of lower cauldron (probably igniting the pulsing sexual energy withing lower tan tien while empty force breathing to sustain life pearl pulsating)
when the drop melts, pearl is then alchemically cultivated
2.inner alchemy
-sound vibrations/visualization
-moving cauldron along the central channel
-including stars, planets
-developing inner senses
-kan and li meditationsThus is fire and water gate tradition of Winn’s HTUSA:
1.fire and water gate
-fusion
-microcosmic orbit
-empty force breathing
-…
when the thunder strikes the sky, then…
2.inner alchemy
-sound vibrations/visualization
-moving cauldron along the central channel
-including stars, planets
-developing inner senses
-kan and li meditationsJanuary 22, 2005 at 10:40 am #2529Michael WinnKeymasterIf this posting is accurate (i.e. by a recent student of Kumar), it is a late development, probably a competitive development to Healing Tao Water and Fire methods.
I took Kumar’s entire training the first time he offered the complete cycle of both his water chi kung and bagua training. At the time he did not know I was teaching inner alchemy, as I had not put out any products. Certainly he knew I had written Mantak’s books, because I helped him write his first book, Open the Energy Gates.
I had long discussions with him about the end development of his alchemical teaching, and they did not include any of the fire methods or use of visualizations, chanting, moving the cauldron. It was limited to Yang spontaneously arising from the water at the end of your life/training.
Certainly he knew of fire methods, but pooh poohed them. He invented the “water school ” of taoism to create a marketing niche. It doesn’t exist in china, according to many of his students who have searched hard (ask Frank Allen, his oldest student).
Of course, you can use any elemental gate – here water gate – as starting point for alchemy. That is same as yin practice of Inner Smile in Healing Tao – it pretty much covers (same dissolving principle, not same technique) everything covered in Kumar’s Water School. To call it water gate would have been accurate and more honest.His books are unfortunately marred by attacks on fire methods. I suspect he found himself locked into a slow deadend of water methods only and is trying to move away from it without calling it that.
January 24, 2005 at 7:36 am #2531JernejParticipantI have never met the man in person.
I have studied all his site, articles, books, tapes, videos.It is in there.
He never said it per se. I do not believe he would utter it to anyone but his lineage succesor of ba gua style. Who would then became guardian of water gate.
But every element I recognized sowhere in his texts. I just framed them together. It takes time to provide references.He has now started (more) teaching new courses: chi kung tui na (tui na that includes root mantras in his teaching) and chi kung of each of five elements (even if he reduces all spoken references, it would be very difficult for him not to introduce concept of feelings in legitimizing need for five elements). So he is teaching sound and feeling chi kung now. No emotions or mental stuff yet, nor any outside weather.
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