Home › Forum Online Discussion › Practice › Slow Exercise Pace better for Longevity (study on jogging vs. running)
- This topic has 12 replies, 5 voices, and was last updated 9 years, 8 months ago by c_howdy.
-
AuthorPosts
-
February 9, 2015 at 11:35 am #43886Michael WinnKeymaster
Note: the next study that needs to be done is comparing jogging with qigong. -M.
Why Jogging May Be Better For Your Health Than Running
If youre a runner who secretly hates running, heres some good news: Taking it down a notch or two, settling into a leisurely jog rather than an all-out run, may actually be better for your health in the long term. A small new study shows what others have hinted at in the past: That jogging may be just as good, and perhaps even better, than running when it comes to how long we live.
The team from Denmark followed over 5000 people taking part in the Copenhagen City Heart Study, and tracked whether they were non-joggers, or joggers who kept a slow, moderate, or strenuous pace. The participants health was tracked over the next 12 years, and so was their mortality: 28 of the joggers and 128 of the non-joggers died.
So the connection was this: Joggers of mild and moderate intensity had a lower risk of death than the strenuous joggers. In fact, the lowest mortality risk was that of the mild intensity joggers. The fast-paced joggers had about the same rate of mortality as sedentary people. This suggests that there may be an upper limit to in vigorous exercise, after which the benefits fall off.
The U-shaped association between jogging and mortality suggests there may be an upper limit for exercise dosing that is optimal for health benefits, said study author Peter Schnohr. If your goal is to decrease risk of death and improve life expectancy, jogging a few times a week at a moderate pace is a good strategy. Anything more is not just unnecessary, it may be harmful.
The other thing thats important to point is out the terminology, adds Schnohr, since definitions can vary greatly, depending on who or what organization is doing the defining. In his study, for example, slow jogging was the equivalent of vigorous exercise by other standards. It is important to emphasize that the pace of the slow joggers corresponds to vigorous exercise and strenuous jogging corresponds to very vigorous exercise, said study author Peter Schnohr. When performed for decades, this activity level could pose health risks, especially to the cardiovascular system.
Strenuous exercise is thought to put additional stress on the cardiovascular system. Marathon running has of course been associated with sudden death in several instances. But more research has shown that mild to moderate exercise, like brisk walking, is quite beneficial and may even be preferable to more intense exercise. From the current study, jogging just three times per week, for less than 2.5 hours/week was associated with the lowest overall mortality risk.
As the authors of the study write, if the goal is to decrease the risk of death and improve life expectancy, going for a leisurely jog a few times per week at a moderate pace is a good strategy. Higher doses of running are not only unnecessary but may also erode some of the remarkable longevity benefits conferred by lower doses of running.
Theres been a lot of mixed messages about the right amount of exercise and what intensity is best. The World Health Organization has suggested that the current 150 minute/week recommendations are too intense for most people to tackle, and that expectations should be lowered, since, after all, anything is better than nothing. A recent study showed that very short bursts of intense activity interspersed with recovery periods is particularly good for the body. Still others have suggested that just 5-10 minutes of slow running a day is linked to reduced risk of heart disease and of death from any cause. And the new study, though quite small in size, adds good evidence that less is sometimes more.
Everyone probably has a level of activity that feels best to him or her. But at least the growing consensus seems to be that more if youre pushing yourself very hard is not necessarily better. And it may even be worse.
February 16, 2015 at 8:35 pm #43887c_howdyParticipant…at the house of the lama who taught him (Milarepa) black magic there lived a trapa [monk] who was fleeter than a horse.
-ALEXANDRA DAVID-NEEL, Magic and Mystery in TibetKaihôgyô. The “practice of circling the mountains”-translated in the book as “mountain marathon”-is an ancient Buddhist tradition likely dating back to the time of Shakyamuni. Hiei Kaihôgyô is a pilgrimage to the sacred sites of the mountain and an appreciation of the principles represented in each respective station of worship. Kaihôgyô is also performed at most of the other holy mountains in Japan.
-JOHN STEVENS, The Marathon Monks of Mount HieiSorry but I think that one shouldn’t have too fixed ideas about this.
For example among those Japanese Tendai practitioners who have gone through kaihoogyoo at least once, there should have been quite recently persons who have been full time alcoholics for years before becoming Buddhist monks; and they have lived to become centenarians.
HOWDY
February 17, 2015 at 2:24 am #43889c_howdyParticipantOn January 14, 2015, Shahlavi died in his sleep at the age of 42. The cause of death has not been revealed.
-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darren_ShahlaviHeart rate is a good measure of how a runner’s body responds physiologically during training. heart rate, or pulse, is the number of times per minute your heart beats. It reflects the amount of work the heart must do to supply blood to the exercising body. Generally the faster it beats, the harder you are working out. The slower it beats in response to vigorous exercise, the better shape you are in. For example, perhaps your heart beat 140 times per minute at a pace of 8 minutes per mile for an easy 5-mile run. After perhaps two monts of quality training, it may rise to only 130 to 135 beats per minute at the same speed and conditions.
-BOB GLOVER & SHELLY-LYNN FLORENCE GLOVER, The Competitive Runner’s HandbookOne can meditate without doing pranayama, but its regular practice is a great help in achieving success in meditation. For example, the stage before dhyana in raja yoga is dharana. Without being able to to concentrate on one object for some time, dhyana is impossible. The usual method is to visualize an internal object with closed eyes. This in itself is not so simple, for any mental image is either blurred of fades away from view within a short time. Pranayama is extremely useful in encouraging the appearance of clear mental images which remain visible for longer periods of time. This is caused by redistribution of prana in the body, which renders the mind more able to perceive and control images.
-SWAMI SATYANANDA SARASWATI, Four Chapters on FreedomTsongkhapa (1357-1419), the founder of what would crystallize into the Gelug sect, is reported to have had repeated visionary encounters with Mañjuśrī, a deity who embodies Buddha’s insight into the nature of reality and who, on a more mundane plane, is associated with intelligence, learning, and skill in speech and composition. Sightings are reported in the hagiographical literature, like the tale of lama who saw Tsongkhapa melt into Mañjuśrī before his eyes during a tantric initiation. In scroll paintings and statues, he materializes iconographically in forms that range from wrathful to pacific. At one end of the spectrum is Vajrabhairava, with a vast array of weapon-bearing arms and blazing head of enraged buffalo. At the other sits Mañjuśrī’s peaceful manifestation: cross-legged, sword in one hand and copy of the Perfection of Wisdon in the other, and wearing cool, sage countenance.
-MICHAEL LEMBERT, Discipline & Debate-The Language of Violence in a Tibetan Buddhist MonasteryThe ceaseless nembutsu involves constant revolution around the hall while chanting endlessly, “namu amida butsu, Hail to Amida Buddha.” In the beginning, Sakai felt as if he were walking on air gliding around the hall; later it was if he were traipsing through deep mud. He slept poorly in the two hours of rest-meditation that he was allowed each day, and during the walking he sometimes lost consciousness temporarily and fell asleep against the railing for five minutes or so. Near the the end of the ninety-day term Sakai perceived himself moving along a narrow white path over a ranging river. Even though he was revolving around a square room, Sakai distinctly sensed himself walking in a straight line as the path opened before him. The ghosts and goblins that had previously threatened him turned into the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas of the Lotus Sutra, and all was peace and light.
-JOHN STEVENS, The Marathon Monks of Mount HieiFour levels of heart rates are important in developing a safe, effective training program: the resting, maximum, training, and recovery heart rates.
-BOB GLOVER & SHELLY-LYNN FLORENCE GLOVER, The Competitive Runner’s HandbookIn my opinion it’s neither about Daoist nor Buddhist practice but something more general.
Also it’s not about speed only but also it’s matter of the lenght of effort.
For example in still existing Tendai nembutsu practice both lenght and special nature of the effort make it interesting.
But there have been also some who have died when pursuing that 90-day term of 20 hour daily walking and chanting, even in the temple.
Sorry for my broken English.
HOWDY
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x9l4ub_thich-qu%E1%BA%A3ng-d%E1%BB%A9c_news (lotussutrabhaisajyaguruagnipujavietnam1963)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OwDyWfjb48 (mortalkombatlegacycyraxsektor)
February 21, 2015 at 2:43 pm #43891c_howdyParticipantThe Rarámuri or Tarahumara are a Native American people of northwestern Mexico who are renowned for their long-distance running ability. In their language, the term rarámuri refers specifically to the men, women are referred to as mukí (individually) and as omugí or igómale (collectively). Originally inhabitants of much of the state of Chihuahua, the Rarámuri retreated to the high sierras and canyons such as the Copper Canyon in the Sierra Madre Occidental on the arrival of Spanish explorers in the 16th century. The area of the Sierra Madre Occidental which they now inhabit is often called the Sierra Tarahumara because of their presence.
-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarahumara_peopleMy suggestion is simply to stop thinking that only slow movement is Daoist.
But I also don’t think that for example drinking corn beer helps becoming better athlete.
HOWDY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnwIKZhrdt4 (tarahumarathletes)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Js_3bIni52I (shaolinironcrotch)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarahumara_people#Athletic_prowess
The Tarahumara word for themselves, Rarámuri, means “runners on foot” or “those who run fast” in their native tongue according to some early ethnographers like Norwegian Carl Lumholtz, though this interpretation has not been fully agreed upon. With widely dispersed settlements, these people developed a tradition of long-distance running up to 200 miles (320 km) in one session, over a period of two days through their homeland of rough canyon country, for inter-village communication and transportation and hunting. Their running in sandals are described in the book Born to Run. The Tarahumara use the toe-strike method of running, which is natural for barefoot running. The long-distance running tradition also has ceremonial and competitive aspects. Often, men kick wooden balls as they run in “foot throwing”, rarajipari, competitions, and women use a stick and hoop. The foot throwing races are relays where the balls are kicked by the runners and relayed to the next runner while teammates run ahead to the next relay point. These races can last anywhere from a few hours to a couple of days without a break. The Tarahumara commonly hunt with bow and arrows, but are also known for their ability to run down deer and wild turkeys. Anthropologist Jonathan F. Cassel describes the Tarahumaras hunting abilities: the Tarahumara literally run the birds to death. Forced into a rapid series of takeoffs, without sufficient rest periods between, the heavy-bodied bird does not have the strength to fly or run away from the Tarahumara hunter.
February 24, 2015 at 2:04 pm #43893qtfaceParticipantThe original post is about longevity. The Tarahumara may be an awesome, interesting tibe but their average lifespan is 45 years. So much for running. I don’t like to run, never did, never will, I plan to slowly walk my way into extreme old age.
March 4, 2015 at 2:40 pm #43895c_howdyParticipantSorry, but this is quite complicated matter.
HOWDY
http://www.mensfitness.com/training/cardio/treadmill-test-predicts-death-risk
Treadmill Test Predicts Death Risk
by Brittany Smith
Ever wonder when you might kick the bucket? If not, stop reading; if so, this research from John Hopkins will intrigue you.
After analyzing data from nearly 60,000 heart stress tests taken by 18 to 96-year-olds over almost 20 years, cardiologists believe theyve developed a formula that predicts death risk.
Researchers have dubbed the longevity-predicting algorithm the “FIT Treadmill Score”. Aside from gender and age, the formula factors in peak heart rate and energy expenditure during a treadmill test that involves increasing speed and incline. These cardiac and respiratory fitness levels offer clues about overall death risk over time, say researchers. In fact, fitness level was the most significant predictor of death in the study, more so than diabetes and family history of premature death. Case in point: a 45-year-old woman with a fitness score in the bottom fifth percentile is estimated to have a 38 percent risk of dying over the next decade, compared with a 2 percent risk for a 45-year-old woman with a top fitness score.
FIT Treadmill Scores range from negative 200 to positive 200; those above 0 have a lower mortality risk and those in the negative range face the highest risk of dying. Here’s how the scoring system breaks down:
>>> 100 or higher = 2 percent risk of dying within the next 10 years
Find Supplements to Fuel Your Training at GNC Live Well >>>
>>> 0 to 100 means = 3 percent risk of dying within the next 10 years
>>> Negative 100 to 0 = 11 percent risk of dying within the next 10 years
>>> Lower than negative 100 = 38 percent risk of dying within the next 10 years
Do you dare test yourself? It could be the swift kick you need to improve your cardiovascular fitness and exercise more. Try one of these five ways to fire up your cardio before you hit the treadmill to get a better score and perhaps, more years to live.
March 4, 2015 at 4:32 pm #43897StevenModeratorLi Ching-Yuen was an herbalist who–by legend–supposed lived to be 256 years old. I don’t know whether that is true or not, but he gave some advice for optimal longevity that I think is really smart:
1. Tranquil mind
2. Sit like a tortoise
3. Walk sprightly like a pigeon
4. Sleep like a dogThe third recommendation “Walk sprightly like a pigeon” is typically taken to mean “brisk walking”. I.E. On a regular daily basis, one should incorporate brisk walking into their day.
Like anything, moderation is key.
Being a sedentary lump that rarely gets out of a chair, will shorten your life.
Being a marathon runner who runs to overexertion, will shorten your life.
In between, is a happy medium that provides an optimal health benefit.In my view, simply doing “qigong” (as is typically meant) does not incorporate enough cardiovascular elements for optimal health. This is one of the reasons why I am an advocate of both the Tai Chi 2 Fast Form and the Big Dipper Qigong form (w/o Michael’s alchemy add-ons). Each of these, is intrinsically done fast–unlike the other qigong forms–and therefore provides this unique benefit of gentle cardiovascular exercise.
Without doing these–or something like these–I do not feel that “qigong”–in and by itself–is enough. One should incorporate around 30 minutes of brisk walking per day IN ADDITION to qigong.
In my personal view . . .
Steven
March 5, 2015 at 10:29 am #43899frechtlingParticipantSounds like someone needs to produce a DVD for Big Dipper Qigong (w/ and w/o alchemy) and for Tai Chi 2…
Just sayin’…I’d buy them…
March 5, 2015 at 10:38 am #43901frechtlingParticipantAnyone have this DVD or know if it’s any good: Mantak Chia’s Tai Chi Chi Kung II ?
March 5, 2015 at 4:38 pm #43903StevenModeratorIt’s an old recording of Master Chia in his 30s, done by a camcorder. You see him teaching a group of people on a tennis court. It’s not the highest production value, but it is better than nothing.
March 8, 2015 at 6:04 am #43905c_howdyParticipantThe Lotus S¨±tra (Sanskrit: Saddharma Puṇḍar¨©ka S¨±tra) is one of the most popular and influential Mah¨¡y¨¡na s¨±tras, and the basis on which the Tiantai, Tendai Cheontae, and Nichiren schools of Buddhism were established.
-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_SutraCarlos Slim Hel¨² (Spanish pronunciation: [ˈkaɾlos esˈlim eˈlu]; born January 2, 1940) is a Mexican business magnate, investor, and philanthropist. From 2010 to 2013, Slim was ranked as the richest person in the world. Known as the “Warren Buffett of Mexico”, Slim has extensive holdings in a considerable number of Mexican companies through his conglomerate, Grupo Carso, SA de CV, have amassed interests in the fields of communications, real estate, airlines, media, technology, retailing, and finance. Currently, Slim is the chairperson and chief executive of telecommunications companies Telmex and Am¨¦rica M¨®vil.
-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_SlimWord was out some men in from Sinaloa were looking for some hands
Well deep in Fresno county there was a deserted chicken ranch
There in a small tin shack on the edge of a ravine
Miguel and Louis stood cooking methamphetamine.
You could spend a year in the orchards
Or make half as much in one ten-hour shift
Working for the men from Sinaloa
But if you slipped the hydriodic acid
Could burn right through your skin
They’d leave you spittin’ up blood in the desert
If you breathed those fumes in
-BRUCE SPRINGSTEEN, Sinaloa CowboysThese Tarahumara indians really seem stubbornly to have stayed away from Mexican mainstream society and are understandably quite freakish in multible ways.
Sorry but I think that if somebody is interested about yogic running one should check Buddhist version.
But both Shaolin and also Japanese Tendai have also clearly they own limitations.
HOWDY
Ps. Sorry, for my broken English.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IZqwkjbO4Y (godsmiddlefinger)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ok_6vvMbYn4 (sinaloacowboys)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAwWPadFsOA (mortalkombatdisco)March 8, 2015 at 8:26 am #43907c_howdyParticipantSo if one still tries to understand why for example those Tarahumaras have developed their running schedule; it’s here.
Even when modern transport should be available there are persons like this.
Why not to buy a nice bike, because it’s clear that from the point of displacement it would be quicker.
HOWDY
Steven Simoff: Iowa man commutes 35 miles to work on foot
The 61 year old wears out a pair of shoes every two months
Andrew Buncombe
Monday, 2 March 2015
Sometimes people stop to pick him up. But in this day and age that is not guaranteed;
motorists are suspicious, worried.
And so on those occasions Steve Simoffs only real alternative is to keep walking. All 35 miles if needed. And then he has to get home.
The 61 year old does not think there is anything that extraordinary about his commute, or that of James Robertson from Detroit, who whose story became international news last month when it was revealed that he been making 21 mile round trip to his factory job for many years.
First of all, when you got a family, and youve got a job, you’ve got to be able to support
your family, Mr Simoff told the Des Moines Register And you’ve got to keep your job the most two important things I can think of.
Mr Simoff, from Davis City, Iowa, works at the Lakeside Casino in Osceola where he
does the night shift as a janitor. His regular shift starts at 11pm and so he sets off on foot most days at 3.30pm. Apart from two fifteen minute breaks, he spends his shift on his feet. He earns $9.07 an hour. He wife receives disability benefit after suffering a stroke.
He said that he never thumbed for a ride but that people stopped to give him a lift, some of the way, three days of five. He said that Sundays were the trickiest as there was less traffic on the road. He told the newspaper he estimated he walked an average of four hours every day and wears out his shoes every two months.
Mr Simoff lives with his wife, Renee, and their grandson, Steven, whom they adopted.
Recently they bought a car but struggle to pay for the petrol. The reason they live in Davis City is the affordable rent just $400 a month.
More recently Mr Simoff has been getting a lift part of the way home with a colleague. As a result he only has an eight mile walk back to his house. The story of Mr Robertsons walk to his factory resulted in an outpouring of public admiration, matched by $350,000 in donations. The money has made life easier for him, but he has had to move out of his home for safety reasons. News stories that will melt your heart Mr Simoff told the newspaper he has no plans at this stage to change his routine. If I dont get to work, bills dont get paid, he said. As long as my two feet are good and my health is good, I don’t think I’ll change.March 8, 2015 at 1:15 pm #43909c_howdyParticipantAlongside his research into the Tarahumara, McDougall delves into why the human species, unique among other primates, has developed traits for endurance running. He promotes the endurance running hypothesis, arguing that humans left the forests and moved to the savannas by developing the ability to run long distances in order to literally run down prey.
-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Born_to_Run:_A_Hidden_Tribe,_Superathletes,_and_the_Greatest_Race_the_World_Has_Never_SeenI’ve been torn about whether to add yet another blog post about the real or imagined links between Micah True’s running and his death. In a sense, blogging about it validates the sense that there must be some “meaning” to be extracted, even though an American under the age of 65 dies from heart disease every 3.5 minutes or so. His death is tremendously sad, but the only thing it tells us for sure is something we’ve known since at least the 1970s: exercise makes you healthier, but it doesn’t make you invincible.
-http://www.runnersworld.com/running-tips/did-running-cause-micah-trues-deathBlack Lizard (üòáÎv Kurotokage) is a 1968 Japanese detective film directed by Kinji Fukasaku. The film is based on a 1934 novel by Edogawa Rampo and its theatrical adaptation by Yukio Mishima, who, at the time, was the lover of Akihiro Maruyama, the actor who plays the notorious female criminal “Black Lizard” in drag.
-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lizard_(film)…original post is about longevity. The Tarahumara may be an awesome, interesting tribe but their average lifespan is 45 years…
One shouldn’t ignore that from any conventional point of view also Buddhism is extreme path.
So for example those Tendai practitioners, who after 1st 100 days of Kaih¨gy¨ decided to continue, were expected to continue until the end or to commit suicide.
HOWDY
Ps. Sorry if the picture really comes through; it’s just to meant to picture various Buddhist ideals. Yukio Mishima really did seppuku, but in that picture he is still only rehearsing as an actor in a movie.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InBXu-iY7cw (usnavaldisco)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KFEfRJqxss (Kurotokage/Black_Lizard)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3t9SfrfDZM (borntorun) -
AuthorPosts
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.