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>>We are here to embrace earth and to honor her, as she is breast feeding so many different life forms<<
Indeed.
This is a time for people like the people on this board! It's one of the things that Greer is trying to get across, which I love, but maybe I haven't made it clear.
Take health for example. How do people normally keep their health in our society? They take a bunch of pills. The pills are manufactured and shipped by giant pharmaceutical companies at enormous expense of oil. They go to gyms with big machines to keep fit.
If the oil runs low, people like Wendy start to become more important. If you can heal with herbs, diagnose with bonetapping, remedy with acupuncture, or whatever your speciality is, you are suddenly very important! Isn't that why we have all been looking for alternatives, at least in part? Don't we sense that the way the mainstream keeps healthy is somehow unhealthy?
If the electricity is off or very expensive, and you can keep yourself fit with qigong and bodyweight exercises alone, aren't you in a better position – not only to survive, but to help others and be at one with nature when others have lost that oneness? Instead of collecting gadgets you have been collecting chi. Good choice!
If you can cure illness with qigong or energy work, you are far more valuable as time goes on and the very expensive and damaging mainstream medical options start to run out.
If you are in touch with nature and know the uses of her bounty without having to rape her with big machines to get at them, you will surive. You will help others to survive. To roll with it, not to mind what is disappearing, because what is still here and what is reappearing is much more beautiful and important, much more natural and human.
Isn't that, at least in part, what Taoism is also about? Don't we see that people are completely separate from nature in the industrial society, and don't we see that reconnecting with nature is paramount – in Taoism, and now in everyone?
If you can communicate with people over hundreds of miles without using a telephone, then if the grid goes down who are people going to call? If you can remain calm and serene when others around you are panicking, aren't you in a better position to respond spontaneously to the situation? – although we aren't talking about total meltdown, we certainly ARE talking about some emergencies at some point. Remember Katrina!
Wendy, haven't the standard medical fraternity frowned on you? You kept to your way and now it will serve a purpose.
This is part of the what the spirits are asking of us, I believe, part of the reason all this spiritual knowledge and understanding are coming out now. Whatever benefits your spiritual way has offered, you can use them.
Not so that we can *escape* the time, but so that we can *help* ourselves, and help *others*, through it.
Everyone else thinks the answer is in more technology, more oil, more war, more TV, more drugs, more more more. Spiritual people know different. It isn't that everything is going to completely collapse – Greer repeats that point again and again – but some people are going to have an easier time with the changes than others.
Those people who take their spirituality seriously, with all the various benefits that brings, are amongst the latter. And their skills will help not only them but everyone else.
Right?
best NN
I did not mingle in this discussion but if you like my opinion in this:
both you and Alexander are right, you are using words but your hearts are heading in the same direction, you are both here on this planet to make a difference, that is all that matters to me:Overall I have a very pessimistic feeling on the ability of humans to adapt to the changes as they start to occur, especially in the west we will have a very hard time with our money-making-attitude.
Many already are crashing under the pressure, suicides are rising, killings, even fathers/mothers killing their entire family, mental hospitals can’t handle the increased number of patients, etc.
But underneath I have incredible joyful feelings, I hardly can wait. I see how networks of people will indeed help and benefit those who are willing to embrace the change.That is why I had a very hard time living amongst so many negative people, but there is change and meeting people who have a similar attitude is like heaven which makes me deeply happy and is giving birth to hidden layers. I see the new attitude gradually kicking in as well many will lose this as they see it as a battle, while in fact it is an embracement.
I understand what Alexander is talking about when he talks about the higher earth. Of course it is on this planet, in this time/space zone, when we meet people with this higher consciousness we see it in their eyes and we feel it as their genereous, open, warm nature is rising, their willingness to help and to support.
We all are still joggling with it as the new dawn is still very very young but I hope to live another 10.000 years to suck this in :))
>>I understand what Alexander is talking about when he talks about the higher earth. Of course it is on this planet, in this time/space zone, when we meet people with this higher consciousness we see it in their eyes and we feel it as their genereous, open, warm nature is rising, their willingness to help and to support.<>Overall I have a very pessimistic feeling on the ability of humans to adapt to the changes as they start to occur, especially in the west we will have a very hard time with our money-making-attitude.<>Many already are crashing under the pressure, suicides are rising, killings, even fathers/mothers killing their entire family, mental hospitals can’t handle the increased number of patients<>I hope to live another 10.000 years to suck this in :))<<
Enjoy! ;}
NN
1st is from Greer –
“Totnes in the UK and Willits, CA in the US are among the towns that have begun to take positive actions. I’ve recently been contacted by a member of the Portland, Oregon peak oil planning team and asked for input — Portland’s a bellwether among Western cities, and if it’s coming to grips with the arrival of the deindustrial age, I may have to let go of my long-held skepticism that governments at any level will do anything constructive about our predicament.”
2nd is from the little ‘taoist daily wisdom’ box that greets me when I log on here:
“To those who beware of calamity, fortune will come. To those who slight fortune, calamity will come.”
Best NN
I don’t see any seperation in this Nnonnth: being loving, caring and embracing the new dawn is NOT in conflict with the old world problems. Being one thing does not exclude something else, contrary, we have an obligation to do our very best to make a difference for as much people as possible.
Those who know, can’t stay aside and wait, those who do ARE NOT part of that particular current, they have another agenda (see New Orleans).
If I look in the eyes of a fellow-friend I see this ‘higher earth’ and it encourages me to work even harder, it is fuel for my heart and makes me embrace even more. It is no new age mambo jambo it is living reality which I can translate in my daily work, my family, my friends, my personal life.
Nnonnth, WE ARE this higher earth, it is not seperate from us, all our actions are creating this ‘new world’, so no way you can sit and wait for IT to happen.
I hope to meet you some day….
I don’t quite understand why the energy coming off of Greer’s essay was negative for Alexander then.
Why see Greer as negative? – he is just doing what he has to do, happens to coincide very well with what I have to do… it isn’t that I see this as interfering with the ‘new earth’ idea – on the contrary to me it enables it. But I don’t understand why Alexander doesn’t see it that way.
NN
You read it in the horizontal world, which means, you read the words and at the end the message is ‘positive’ which you understand and resonate with so well,
I can’t speak for Alexander but I admitt there is something with the sphere of that piece, it immediately turned me off, and I admitt I didn’t even read it the whole way because of it. I read your comments so I understand what you find worth in this piece.
Here’s excerpts from an article, a link to the full version of which I post at the end. It’s from a report by Aaron Newton on a recent energy conference in Ohio.
>>>
What a wonderful experience to be able to share a weekend with those who understand the need for change. I am excited and inspired and more full of hope than I have been in quite a while. I come away from the experience better informed and ready for action. I am happy about the friendships that grew out of the conference, and I am grateful for those who came to share the comprehension necessary for the next step. The time has come. We are ready to deploy our weapons of mass sustainability. Sharon Astyk made the remark that with an attendance of more than 250 people, the Third US Conference on Peak Oil and Community Solutions had more than the necessary number of people required to start a revolution. It is here. The time is now.
There are many well-meaning environmentalists moving to activate change in alternative fuel types, emission standards, pollution regulations and more. I have been dismayed though that these substitutes are at the forefront of the response to a peak in global oil production and the coming climate change. I dont doubt that the best of intentions are in mind when these business as usual suggestions are made. I continue to be skeptical though concerning the effectiveness of the message that more is still better and all is possible if only we believe. Plan B has been the idea that more, bigger and faster is an acceptable idea and that we need only switch from one fuel source to another. More power plants are not a problem. Well just pump the pollution underground. More cars are not a problem. Well just fuel them with corn. More of everything isnt a problem well just This has been the approach.
So while everyone else is scrambling to perpetuate the status quo, I went to Yellow Springs, Ohio, population 3500, to visit with a group of people who have a different idea. Its Plan C, and its the idea that curtailment is necessary. Maybe we dont need more, bigger and faster. Maybe if we re-examine the problem, well find a solution so obvious and so remarkable that we will slap ourselves silly for not seeing it earlier. What if we purposely live with less? Alternative fuels are great. They will play a part in the coming energy descent. Of that I have no doubt, but will they save us? No. Misplaced faith in these alternatives could do more harm than good by perpetuating the idea that there isnt a problem at all. This is why Ive been in search of another perspective from which to view our problems and now Ive found it. Here is the idea that we can shrink ourselves into safety, security and happiness. Reduction and relocalization is an idea that is not only acceptable but palatable and actually, quite tasty. Think about itits exactly what we need.
Consumerism sucks. After September 11, 2001, I was told that the best thing I could do for my country was to go shopping. What a joke. There has been no real examination of the problem- we are taking too much. If the practice of consuming as much as possible leads to a better life, then it might be something worth fighting for. But it doesnt. Americans are fat and sick and disconnected from the natural world and from each other. We are in desperate need of health, we are in desperate need of time spent outside, and we are in desperate need of quality relationships in community with others. We have become desperate people. More than one quarter of us are reported to be seeking a simpler way of life. Given a choice, I think citizens (currently called consumers) of the United States of America are ready to trade in the broken nightmares of increased growth and irresponsible expansion for the happy realities of reasonable limits that will allow them to focus on family and friendship.
<<<
Still think the energy is negative????
Best NN
Nnonnth, Your tone is accosting and you are definitely misuderstanding me.
Here are some responses but after this I will let the conversation go.
“- this article obviously was not intended for someone like you. I respect that.”
Here you are passing me off because you do not like what I say. The article is meant for anyone who reads it, not just for those who agree with it. What one does with something after they get it is in alignment with their intent and need. Mine differs from yours.
“But I must say one thing –
>>Those of us with fear will find ourselves on a planet pretty similar to this one. Those of us who have transmuted most or all of it will end up on a level much higher. This is what daoism is about.<<I disagree with this SO completely!
I would like to ask, where is it, this higher-vibrational earth?
I speak as someone who has visited some of the higher spheres.
Where is it located?
If it is not physical (and it can't be) it is an astral realm."Here you assume you know a lot more than you do. Many of us have had experiences in other realms. None of us know about them all and none of us know as much as the lifeforce about how to solve problems and put people where they belong. The other earths are right here in the same space but each vibrates differently. Like the bands on a radio, you choose to listen to one frequency to the exclusion of all the rest.
"When I've lived out my life here, then I'll exit and go – not to some preordained heaven, prepared for me by a bunch of spirits – but where I choose to go."
This comment sounds like defensive anger and fear of victimization. Who said anything about any other spirits directing your destiny? I am talking about resonance with a life affirming lifeforce, as I said. We are where we are because we now resonate with that place. This is all vibrational. Law of Attraction.
"What you are clearly talking about is that these 'higher' and 'lower' earths are heavenly and hell-like respectively. That is a judgement my friend, and it's not one I'm willing to make. Only if you pre-judge this earth as miserable and horrible do you wish to escape to somewhere else."
I love the earth. I never said this is a bad place. When you say I am making here hell and the future heaven these are your own conclusions. Yes, some of what we are living here is hell and yes I believe we will continue to grow and vibrate higher and have more "heaven" all based on what we are creating/vibrating to. But that observation is much more neutral than you presume. My purpose in being here is to transmute myself and help in the greater process as I do so. None of this is escapism. I am not leaving till I'm thru. And where I go will be the result of my intention and the amount of love I can create along the way.
"Or do you say that those who are left on your 'lower' earth should just be abandoned?"
"Lower," as I say it, is not a judgement. It is an energetic vibration. Fear is a lower vibration than love, etc. I think you know what I mean.
It seems to me that my opinion has triggered fear in you because the tone of your response is defensive. Look closely. You seem to be projecting.
Thank you and blessings, Alexander
I really appreciate your feeling tone here, N. You show care and concern. It’s soft, and that is what (I believe) Wendy is saying that is missing from the Greer piece. That is why it was a turnoff to us. (That right, Wendy?)
Ultimately, as Wendy has perceived, you and I are on the same spiritual page. But we are approaching things differently. And we are both very passionate.
Do not misunderstand and think for a moment that I do not care about what happens “down” here. What I get concerned about, which parallels in intensity what YOU get concerned about but in a different way, is that people will not “get it” and things will fail. This is a fear to let go of!
So, for me, I am triggered by people’s tendency to go into alarm instead of trust, and to try to take control of the reigns that only the lifeforce knows how to hold. If I am wrong about Greer, I apologize. But I do not favor the kind of energy he is generating (as I read it) as the means through which our situation shall be resolved.
Of course, we will all have to participate in some way with the coming changes. I never said there wouldn’t be any, or that we should stay industrialized. That way of living is a demented joke to me. But we do not have to presume that “decline” means hardship or insisting that we all have two cars… like you fear some of us are thinking. I prefer to leave it open and generate love and assume that the dao will organize things well for us. My part is to be a clear agent in relationship with it. That is what wuwei means – a relationship created with the lifeforce through trust. It trusts you, so it lets itself come through you. This is not a naive or irresponsible attitude. And it is daoism’s core. “Sitting still, doing nothing, grass grows and spring comes” and “Don’t interfere and everything will get done” imply a state of grace and wholeness. Consciousness and responsible action at its best.
I would like to repeat one of my major points particularly in view of your concern that if we are “too spiritual” that we will flunk out of here.
As we generate, so do we create. This is a law. If we are all caught up in how something can transpire and we have worry and fear, all we will accomplish is to create stressful circumstances. Being realistic does not mean limiting what is possible. Seeing the best of times during the worst of times is the spiritually responsible thing to do because then you are generating from a higher vision instead of from what you fear will happen. What would Jesus do?
Let us remember who we really are and let that manifest.
Peace! Alexander
>>Indead the old way is to try to change things just in the physical realm but this is not a holistic approach.<<
Nor is to concentrate only on the spiritual.
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""just in the physical" "holistic approach""
Do not let your fire burn you up, balance it with your motherly energy.Ask me to pray with you brother for world peace, and I will. Ask me to stand with you for hope, acceptance, free will, and I will. It was an ok artical, but not one that I would base my life around. I would ask people to pray amd meditate on a regural basis. The focus an personal accpetance, and world peace. There actions from there would be of a beautiful intent. If you took away accptance from your practice how would it change. I do not believe he was assuming popel knew the importance of prayer. The only real thing I liked about the artical was that he was driving home the fact taht we need to work with nature. But I do not think you can judge this future by the past energy, Niether did the mayans. There calander notes this around 2012. I did feel that he was trying to say life will go on. I like that aditude. It was an ok call to wake up. Not a great one. Accept those that help out in New Orleans, to those that meditate in mountains, to those that smile and pray while doing laundry. You must also acept the chooses of those that choose the old way. Every thing has its time.
You (Nnonnth and Alexander) are like two knights fighting for the same cause, yes with a lot of passion that occasionally drives you away from each other while in fact you are heading for the holy grail.
Nnonnth the fact that Alexander and I did not like the piece has nothing to do with you, as I figure that you take it too personal as you posted it.
1.I just didn’t like the deduction he made, applying scenario’s from other time zones onto this one, while in fact we DON’T KNOW.
What if a bunch of aliens land on planet earth, how would that change the world completely and completely differently than ever we have known in written history.
How can we prepare for that we don’t know….2. I just didn’t like the negative tone set, yet with a positive ‘solution’. I just feel much resistance to people who try to stirr things with fear, no matter if the result is ‘positive’ at the end; I just dislike the approach. But that is my feeling Nnonnth, not a solid fact. That is why I did not mingle in the discussion because I could see as well how it gave you ‘hope’ and encouraged you to post it for us, in an attempt to help us all. So there is absolute no judgment towards you; contrary I thank you for it.
I like your passion though, IF at the end there is a honest heartful and truthful understanding of the difference. While most people want acknowledgment for what they believe and stand for, and try to force it on others. It means to me they are unsure and are looking for by-standers to agree with them. Or they don’t have the flexibilty to appreciate the intention and believe of the other…that is when knights start the fight…that is when wars arise…that is when worlds decline
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