February 1, 2009 at 1:29 pm #30426
This is a serious question!!!
If you buy into this “binary soul doctrine” or some
version thereof, then . . .
The waking world is driven by the “logical, awareness soul
fragment” (for the Lost Secret of Death people, the “ba”
in the Egyptian beliefs) with the “emotional, memory soul fragment”
(the “ka” in the Egyptian beliefs) as more of servant. Then
when you go to sleep in the dreamland, this switches with
the “emotional, memory soul fragment” taking the driver’s seat and
letting the other one rest.
By doing Dream Practice, are you short-circuiting this?
And in doing so, are you causing problems by not letting the
“emotional, memory” soul take the driver’s seat and express itself?
Are you causing a form of repression?
At the very least, you are preventing the “normal”, “seemingly random”,
creation of dreams from taking place. How do you know that this isn’t
necessary for the evolution of your soul, and that you are creating
problems by saying “shut up, I’m going to run the show”.
My question is very serious. I’ve thought about it a lot.
In fact, last night I had some dreams (non-directed) that I feel
were very meaningful and have helped me to progress in a way I don’t
think I would have, if “I” had been running the show. In particular,
the dreams brought to light some things I wasn’t aware of.
I haven’t learned the Dream Practice yet, but I’d like some input on
this issue before I consider it. Part of me almost feels like your
dreaming self should be given “free reign” and noninterference–but
I welcome outside opinion.
StevenFebruary 2, 2009 at 10:01 am #30427
I am sure some one might look at Dream practice as a way to try and further there obsession with control. I would highly recommend the dream practice audio set. It goes over the dance of giving a communication and getting responses, not control. My understanding of dream practice is ultimately it is to get to a state of no sleeping no waking this is not ultimate control but the ultimate surrendrance to the tao. Over time your dreams becomes more solid your waking life becomes more fluid till they are one. You could say you awaken in the day time.
It is said that soon after his enlightenment the Buddha passed a man on the road who was struck by the Buddhas extraordinary radiance and peaceful presence.
The man stopped and asked, My friend, what are you? Are you a celestial being or a god?
No, said the Buddha.
Well, then, are you some kind of magician or wizard?
Again the Buddha answered, No.
Are you a man?
Well, my friend, then what are you?
The Buddha replied, I am awake.February 2, 2009 at 11:02 pm #30429
Can you briefly explain what the difference is between
“Taoist Dream Practice” and what is popularly known as
“Lucid Dreaming”–because the latter I seem to remember
being advertised as “become aware that you are dreaming,
and then decide how you want the dream to proceed”?
I personally don’t feel like I’m bright enough to
know “what’s best for me”, and so it brings the
concern that by infiltrating the dreamscape that
I’ll actually be inhibiting/slowing down normal progress,
because maybe the dream self knows better (I don’t
know if you know what I mean here). How do you create
a state of more surrender, not less? How do you not
suppress the intelligence of the “dream self” (if there
is such a thing).
My question is sort of aiming at the idea of moving
beyond the “cool, I can function in the dreamland”
to “am I doing something useful or am I doing something
I guess part of my problem is that I don’t really know
what the practice entails. I assume that part of the
training involves gaining awareness in the dreamscape, but
I guess the question is, what do you do when that occurs?
Specific details aren’t necessary, but if you can provide
“the big picture” it’d be great.
Side question: If you do do dream practice, have
you–while being aware in the dreamscape–tried doing
qigong and meditation? I wonder what the result would be. 🙂
SFebruary 3, 2009 at 8:14 am #30431
You do not control the dream just as you do not control the life force when awake. Lucid dreaming is training the jing shen to more fully take part shen chi and jing. You certainly can do practices thats another great part you are less resistant while dreaming so practicing can be very powerful. I totally understand the fear in not wanting to develop rigidity in the one place you might feel is so fluid but you have the wisdom and love to make your waking state more fluid and your dreaming more solid and experience both from a non wake or dream core space. Hope this helps.February 4, 2009 at 10:46 am #30433
>>>I totally understand the fear in not wanting to develop rigidity
>>>in the one place you might feel is so fluid
Yes, this is the issue.
I just don’t want the ego to replace the current structure
(and whatever its purpose is) in dreamland with an idea
that it now has access to extended wakefulness (think
one country invading another so they can have their land).
I guess the trick is to develop a communication while
still maintaining a respect for whatever purpose the
dream realm has. That’s more of a “get to know you”
attitude than a “now, I’m running the show” attitude
>>>but you have the wisdom and love to make your waking state
>>>more fluid and your dreaming more solid and experience
>>>both from a non wake or dream core space.
Thanks for your trust in my wisdom and love 🙂
Hopefully it would be approached that way.
That’s part of the reason for the discussion I think–
trying to see if there is a healthy point of view
that can be adopted–one that can possibly be nourishing.
Then use intuition to see how the shen feel about it,
before blazing off on some new path without regard to
the consequences to the greater being.
SFebruary 5, 2009 at 5:14 am #30435
winn dream course is good indoctrination
thus should be some similarities
ala robert monroe astral projection
wood element practice
as glenn morris made a comment
‘and can see in his liver’ or somethin like that
about a boy
however going back to monroe
after his happening
he did not sleep a lot
but his photos revealing
like kidney exhaustion
might even be written something like the rv literature
are not ego commands
observe the picture conscious work is not very deepy
thoughts are deeper
yet thought is not superficial word
it is concrete
or perhaps even abstract
or even symbolic
this is already more deep
so is also with conscious control
one can go deep only as much
before having to split up
which is not nourishing
going unconscious is nourishing
dream yoga solving
allign with a issue
mental wondering is one way out
but when tired stay here
when going down
when coming back the issue will still be there
so when unconscious conscience meets issue anew
new learning is gained
there is method of going down and
method of going up
if superficial dream command is superficial
what makes it deep
emotions are deeper that abstractions but less then symbols
after recognizing symphatetic link between problem and its emotional content
allign with both
when going down first the knowleables will go
but with holding the issue dear
dearness will go further
what is that one invested more energy in than ones life
‘live good life die good death’ bkf
what one invests time during the day
thath one sowesth
ritualistic or not
that revealed the deepest issue and deepest dream command
any aimed dream yoga is consumption
for aimed work even proffesion writers recommend writing down immediatelly
for life work such is unnecessary. Such happenings are like automatic upgrades for next time work
dream yoga is true self work.
Ego is mouth of self
dream work unconscious touch
not lucid/manifest light
dreamwork makes omens understanding
positions may be shifted but emotions is truer
possibilities are to rise up to or let them slide
rigor (AOL of rv) may weed incorrectness out
but learning growth will slack
photo from joe macmoneagle mind trek book p.80
http://www.geocities.com/hjgfjhgjh/consciousness.continuum.JPGFebruary 20, 2009 at 7:05 pm #30437
Your fears are unfounded, as they are the projected fears of the lesser self about communicating with the Greater Self which is more accessible in dream space. Lesser self could not control that space even if it wanted to – it doesn’t exist there.
dreamspace is no different than space of deep meditation, which is making the space conscious.
Why leave night space unconscious?
The True Dark Side is your friend, don’t be afraid to make friends with it.
michaelFebruary 25, 2009 at 7:44 pm #30439
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