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Is Physical Immortality a Dangerous Idea? Ray Kurzweil.

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Home › Forum Online Discussion › Philosophy › Is Physical Immortality a Dangerous Idea? Ray Kurzweil.

  • This topic has 3 replies, 3 voices, and was last updated 19 years, 4 months ago by Moonglow.
Viewing 4 posts - 1 through 4 (of 4 total)
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  • January 20, 2006 at 8:43 am #9916
    Michael Winn
    Keymaster

    “What is your dangerous idea?” Over one hundred big thinkers answered this
    question, as part of The Edge’s Annual Question for 2006
    <http://www.edge.org/q2006/q06_index.html>.

    Ray Kurzweil’s dangerous idea?
    We can achieve immortality in our lifetime.

    ………..

    My dangerous idea is the near-term inevitability of radical life extension
    and expansion. The idea is dangerous, however, only when contemplated from
    current linear perspectives.

    First the inevitability: the power of information technologies is doubling
    each year, and moreover comprises areas beyond computation, most notably our
    knowledge of biology and of our own intelligence. It took 15 years to
    sequence HIV and from that perspective the genome project seemed impossible
    in 1990. But the amount of genetic data we were able to sequence doubled
    every year while the cost came down by half each year.

    We finished the genome project on schedule and were able to sequence SARS in
    only 31 days. We are also gaining the means to reprogram the ancient
    information processes underlying biology. RNA interference can turn genes
    off by blocking the messenger RNA that express them. New forms of gene
    therapy are now able to place new genetic information in the right place on
    the right chromosome. We can create or block enzymes, the work horses of
    biology. We are reverse-engineering — and gaining the means to reprogram —
    the information processes underlying disease and aging, and this process is
    accelerating, doubling every year. If we think linearly, then the idea of
    turning off all disease and aging processes appears far off into the future
    just as the genome project did in 1990. On the other hand, if we factor in
    the doubling of the power of these technologies each year, the prospect of
    radical life extension is only a couple of decades away.

    In addition to reprogramming biology, we will be able to go substantially
    beyond biology with nanotechnology in the form of computerized nanobots in
    the bloodstream. If the idea of programmable devices the size of blood cells
    performing therapeutic functions in the bloodstream sounds like far off
    science fiction, I would point out that we are doing this already in
    animals. One scientist cured type I diabetes in rats with blood cell sized
    devices containing 7 nanometer pores that let insulin out in a controlled
    fashion and that block antibodies. If we factor in the exponential advance
    of computation and communication (price-performance multiplying by a factor
    of a billion in 25 years while at the same time shrinking in size by a
    factor of thousands), these scenarios are highly realistic.

    The apparent dangers are not real while unapparent dangers are real. The
    apparent dangers are that a dramatic reduction in the death rate will create
    over population and thereby strain energy and other resources while
    exacerbating environmental degradation. However we only need to capture 1
    percent of 1 percent of the sunlight to meet all of our energy needs (3
    percent of 1 percent by 2025) and nanoengineered solar panels and fuel cells
    will be able to do this, thereby meeting all of our energy needs in the late
    2020s with clean and renewable methods. Molecular nanoassembly devices will
    be able to manufacture a wide range of products, just about everything we
    need, with inexpensive tabletop devices. The power and price-performance of
    these systems will double each year, much faster than the doubling rate of
    the biological population. As a result, poverty and pollution will decline
    and ultimately vanish despite growth of the biological population.

    There are real downsides, however, and this is not a utopian vision. We have
    a new existential threat today in the potential of a bioterrorist to
    engineer a new biological virus. We actually do have the knowledge to combat
    this problem (for example, new vaccine technologies and RNA interference
    which has been shown capable of destroying arbitrary biological viruses),
    but it will be a race. We will have similar issues with the feasibility of
    self-replicating nanotechnology in the late 2020s. Containing these perils
    while we harvest the promise is arguably the most important issue we face.

    Some people see these prospects as dangerous because they threaten their
    view of what it means to be human. There is a fundamental philosophical
    divide here. In my view, it is not our limitations that define our humanity.
    Rather, we are the species that seeks and succeeds in going beyond our
    limitations.

    January 20, 2006 at 11:16 am #9917
    .freeform.
    Participant

    I’m a big fan of Ray Kurzweil – his book called ‘Age of The Spiritual Machines’ really got me thinking about biological evolution as well as our current technological evolution. I’m also a bit of a sucker for rampant optimism. I find our age facinating we really do live in the Information Age where all our scientific knowledge doubles every year – today we have more scientists doing research than all of our past history put together.

    However I’m not such an optimist as Kurzweil and I can plainly see that although scientific knowledge increses exponentialy, our own intelect stays relatively still! By 2020 we’ll have domesticated primates (also known as humans) playing with very complicated (and somewhat dangerous) toys. As primates we have certain drives that makes us do stupid things, one of these is getting stuck on beliefs (which I discussed in the “Religion: The Root of All Evil??” post) –

    The other, perhaps most dangerous drive is our drive to hoard! This includes hoarding land, money, food, energy (oil), people’s trust etc. This hoarding reflex is dangerous because when activated it is far more powerfull than our drive to help our fellow man – in fact peoples lives matter very little and are pretty expendable if you have a chance to hoard some oil or land.

    We think of ourselves as ‘modern man’ – we see all the amazing things that we have created all around us, this makes us forget about our primate nature – whether we like it or not, we are still animals with simple animalistic drives, and an exeptional ability to create tools to achieve the aims of those drives.

    Lets say that Kurzweil’s prediction comes true, unless we resolve our primitive nature most people will not benefit from these advances in science – and here comes the surprising punch-line – I believe that spiritual technology (such as Taoist Alchemy, Hermetic Magick etc) does just that! So if we are truly to progress and evolve in a balanced and effective way, we have to adopt spiritual technology as our main mode of personal development. Can you imagine spiritualy evolved people using these amazing tools for the betterment of all living things? (damn! – there is that optimistic streak again)

    – The Pope of Blind Ranting –

    January 21, 2006 at 10:01 am #9919
    Michael Winn
    Keymaster

    Right on, Pope. I will join your Holy Crusade for spiritual techology. Let’s just keep it heart-centered, the inner point of balance and knowing that cannot be manipulated.
    -foot soldier in your crusade

    January 21, 2006 at 1:41 pm #9921
    Moonglow
    Participant

    Amen … me too.

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