November 24, 2006 at 9:23 am #19310
Swiss scientists stimulated certain connections in the brain and found out that the way we experience our body becomes scrambled. The brain produces an image that is dislocated from the body. The image is projected in front, below or behind the physical body. In the two first cases the person still recognizes his own body, when felt behind it is felt as a dark and treathening appearance.November 24, 2006 at 10:52 am #19311
As a result of trauma your mental body dissociates from the map of the physical body, or in certain cases a schizoid break occurs w/ normal functioning of one personality whilst another ‘hides in’ a part of the body and refuses to undestand the rest of the body.
I recommend some use of 4 directions in order to realign.
It has nothing to do with OBE though. In this phenomenon the scientists are looking at, the body is still sensed but the sense (mental body) does not seem to match up with the physical location of the body (the top of the head is ‘off to the left’ or whatever), thus causing a *static* dislocation. In OBE however the three bodies match up perfectly, but the mental and astral ones are joined and separated from the physical.
How do I know? I have experienced both!
I would say the scientists doing this are causing harm, especially with those which cause the qoph-subconscious to dislocate, making fear in the subject. Such an experiment is inhuman.
NNNovember 24, 2006 at 11:40 am #19313
I had one giving birth to my oldest daughter, the pain was so intense that I dislocated, and took distance from the body in pain, looking at it.
Another one when my partner, for fun, scared me in the dark. I was in such a panic that I dislocated, he found me in a foetus position, completely blanked. Like an animal keeping itself death when treathened, my body was there but I was not there. Trauma’s can cause dislocation.
I am just fascinated by the possibilities of the body-brain, not just the head brain but the whole body sensitivity… how could I not as an alchemist. So I look with interest what scientists find out.
Some days ago I saw a fascinating documentary about the ‘memory’ of the organs, within transplanted people. And the findings of brain neurons within the heart and probably in the other organs, if not in much more of our body. They concluded that we ‘think’ with our body/organs. The heart thinks much faster than the upper brain. Nothing new for us but just great to see scientists finding ‘evidence’.November 24, 2006 at 1:53 pm #19315
– which I understand does happen a fair amount. However it is not the same as what those scientists discovered.
If you have a sense of having actually *left your body*, then that is an OBE (whether trauma-induced or otherwise) and you are interacting with the astral. What those scientists induced was a dislocation of the body sense, the mental body. There is then no feeling of having left one’s body at all, just a feeling that bits of the body you are still inhabiting are in the wrong place or do not link up right.
My version of this was caused by an extended illness ages 2-5 which laid down a fairly deep trauma. In my first attempts to induce energy cycles I notice jumps and slides in my energy body as my mental one attempted to combine multiple selves, each of which had a different view of where the body was. This took a long time to heal!
The two experiences are very different. OBE feels like freedom, whereas dislocation (to call it that) feels simply uncomfortable. The false body sense that one gets if dislocated from true body awareness is in fact more or less the opposite of the very strong body awareness required to project astrally.
When you left your body during childbirth that was a classic OBE. Using OBE technique I am quite certain one can endure any kind of pain – mind you I hope no-one has to use the technique for that, but still it’s true.
As for these scientists, I am afraid I care less than you. They pass electric currents through people in order to ‘officially prove’, to the warped societal standards we are all supposed to be following, what was already true in any case. Being scared of a body that is in fact yours and which you both *know* you are inside *and* feel is looming up behind you, is an unpleasant experience and should not be artificially induced in anyone in my opinion. Maybe because of my experiences I am overreacting, but it’s what I feel. These people are meddling in the mind for no good reason, and I do not believe anything useful can come of it except that science can claim more ‘knowledge’ and in doing so move still further from the truth of existence.
best NNNovember 24, 2006 at 2:50 pm #19317
I believe as well that OBE is a way of ‘escaping’ pain.
I once knew a woman with very severe childabuse, she created extreme forms of it, multiple selfs were created, over 35, to help her deal with life. No way you could figure which part of her that was talking to you was really her. She could ‘dislocate’ herself in a splitsecond, was no longer present and came back, sometimes hours or days later. In the periods that she was gone she was taken over by another part, she could move heavy rocks, started to build houses, climbing on roofs, amazing stuff while she has a very severe bone disease, breaking her bones very easily (no wonder she had bone problems btw)or she wandered around for hours without knowing where she was, at least when she came back she found herself, hours from her house. Her body was one big scar from broken bones, and self destructive cuttings. So lost, so sad.
She was extremely sensitive, could smell shit from miles away, survival tools, like an animal in danger. She claimed I was the only person that understood her, and I think I did indeed.
She told me during the abuse she zapped herself out of her body, in an attempt to survive and not feel the pain. Unfortunately the damage was so extremely deep I don’t saw any chance for her to heal from it.
The men who did this may burn in hell.
Beside this there are other OBE’s, I know those too btw, other story…
And yes despite the fact I see many bad things happening in the medical industry, that was the reason I quit my job in the hospital, I am positive in a way that they might find pathways to help people… it is a path, like yours, like mine, one that can have positive outcomesNovember 24, 2006 at 6:09 pm #19319
>>Unfortunately the damage was so extremely deep I don’t saw any chance for her to heal from it.<<
That is so very very sad…
Of course I meant that OBE can be used consciously – if it is being used as an instinctive defence mechanism it's very different.
With someone like that it is extremely difficult to see a way back and it does make you wonder what on earth the universe thinks it is doing… I suppose it is the dark side of human free will. There is only so much excusing of it that can be done on the grounds of the abusers themselves having been abused.
Another thing that can happen is that people invent characters to take them away from childhood abuse, which later turn on them in adulthood in sexual situations. These entities can end up destroying the lives of the people who created them – but similarly, this is actually a very useful magical technique if done in a controlled way by an adult instead of an instinctive way by a child.
The two phenomena are actually very similar I think, the only difference being whether the invented selves are externalized or internalized.
What I feel in looking at this woman you describe is indeed that sense of the alert animal trying to survive. I have often felt that curing anything like that is a matter of applying as much stimulation in a calm manner as was previously applied in an alarming manner. But I have never seen anything so serious. I have to say again that my heart goes out to her.
Of course modern medicine can have positive results! But you read these Swiss guys – what were they doing it all for???
NNNovember 25, 2006 at 12:46 am #19321
I am reminded of a qoute I saw. I can not remember the guys name but he was a top research on schizophrenia. Any way he said that “mental disease is the minds attempt to balance its self.” As you would have a fever if you where physically sick. I thought this was pretty good for western science. I like the 5 shen being guided by the self cosmology out of all that I have seen.
YOu can not lose that spark so there is always a chance. Pray for her see her healthy and joyfull. Just a litle more light on her path to help her us her free will.November 25, 2006 at 8:27 am #19323
Within some people the pain they suffered has damaged their earth so deeply it can not be healed, they need others to be their earth for them.
In case of the woman, she started to want my friendship, which I could not give because that friendship was not based on an EQUAL feeling. I would always be her guide and she would follow me because I was the one who understood her pain… that is not a friendship but a savior-victim relationship.
I believe we have an obligation to create and stabilize earth within ourselves and offer that to the larger field. As well we have an obligation to help others, to give them a change to heal and rest and feel comfort.
Yet they can not WANT my friendship, because that implicates that both have sufficient earth…
And that is the main problem with this planet, we live on it but we don’t connect with it, so we drift and feel without inner compass looking for the ‘enemy’. Those with enough inner earth, have enough ‘real’ inner confidence and don’t need to attack others nor invade other countries… no need for slaughter, murder, rape because all you are is inside of you, you don’t NEED anything else from another person, nor another country, nor another universe…
That is why I see it is my obligation as an alchemist and a human being to embrace earth, to love earth, to drink it, to eat it,to breath it..
and as one of my very few real friends said yesterday:
…breath the life sweet sister…
That is what real friends wish for each other as we share the same deep love for this planet…this shared love takes us even deeper into our own process, this love is the ultimate medicine for our healing, for our planet. This combined love is so powerful it can make a change… Earth first!November 25, 2006 at 9:01 am #19325
>>I believe we have an obligation to create and stabilize earth within ourselves and offer that to the larger field<<
I've been thinking about this too. Many people I know wish to 'help others' in some way but are not themselves balanced and I have seen harm come of it. There is just no way in Western society that people can be naturally balanced and earthed! So there is this need to develop oneself first and be strong, connected, absolutely. Then when you offer yourself it is more than just you, it is a piece of everything.
I was going to write an essay about the loss of earth and feminine energy in Western spirituality which dates back to the Gnostics and Christians particularly, but I got stuck! I will post it if it ever comes to anything. The point is that rebalancing to stability in an earthing direction is more needed than ever – *nothing* about our current society is in any way conducive to it…. very glad that people are experimenting, coming to their own conclusions, and waking up from their trances a little.
PS If you want me to turn Paolino into a frog just say the word. :}November 25, 2006 at 9:29 am #19327
can anyone give me a clue how to that?
I want Paolino to look as one of my beloved earth trolls… I will show you if I can insert a pictureNovember 25, 2006 at 10:20 am #19329November 25, 2006 at 10:47 am #19331November 25, 2006 at 11:11 am #19333
testNovember 25, 2006 at 11:42 am #19335November 25, 2006 at 12:51 pm #19337
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.