January 24, 2006 at 11:41 pm #10003
I am in a what you might call ‘karmatic’ process under two senior, humble, experinced & grounded spiritual healers.
The process is about reversing deep rooted bonds and tendencies.
but now I have lost all faith in them.
My purpose is not to dwell into what exactly happened.
I am just seeing after 4+ months of intense personal work, 3 full days a week – and this is after years of standard approaches – things get worse, I am getting more sensitive, disturbed, neurotic etc.
In fact as I type there is no one there for me. I feel scarred and badly wounded, and trapped. nothing is light..
I read so many books, and thought so much, now everything is misery and I am confused and frightened. Nothing helps!
I dont know why I am typing this but I think im on my way to my 3rd suicide attempt
🙁January 25, 2006 at 1:17 am #10004
< <<I read so many books, and thought so much, now everything is misery and I am confused and frightened.>>>
You are right- everything is misery, and recognizing that is a good start.
But you need to understand where the misery is coming from. In fact, Buddha spent his whole life trying to find an answer to the same question. After he did, he started teaching people, in a language everyone could relate to, how to get rid of their misery and suffering.
And so, what did Buddha discovered that helped him and many others to be free from their karmic bond? Buddha saw, after years of deep internal observations, that a person’s mind is the source of all their misery and suffering. Here is how it happens:
1. Everything in this world is made of 5 elements.
2. Human body experiences a combination of these 5 elements though your 5 senses. Like for instance, a woman passing by. You see her through your eyes, you may smell her perfume, she maybe talking and you hear the sound of her voice, etc.
3. Your mind gathers all the information from your 5 senses and put a ‘label’ on it: the woman is pretty and you like that, you don’t really like her perfume, the sound of her voice is very gentle and soft and it reminds you of someone else you knew before. Your mind has developed a complex combination of labels to chose from- not just ‘like and dislike’, or ‘love and hate’. These labels are your emotions and feelings.
4. After you experienced a complex mix of emotion and feelings- they could be very slight and subtle, or strong and heavy- you develop either a clinging or aversion, again they could be very strong or subtle- all based on the experience of your senses and the reaction of your mind.
Buddha discovered that this clinging/attachment or aversion/rejection is the culprits that make people’s suffering possible. That beautiful woman you saw is gone, but because of your emotional response you are still thinking about her. You cling to the feelings that contact with her had produced and you want to experience them again and again. But because the woman is not there with you, you can’t do that, and so you suffer.
The opposite example is someone called you a bad name. You hear it through your ears, your see the person’s angry face, and you might feel their anger through other means. Your mind immediately puts ‘labels’ on your senses- disappointment, rejection, anger, etc. You don’t like the experience of someone’s calling you a name and you have an aversion/rejection toward it. It may long be in the past but that negative feeling is still there, and every time you see this person you may feel a complex mix of feelings toward them.
Buddha saw all of that and he realized this process above is the source of all people’s suffering, and also what shapes their destiny and makes their karma. As the nature of all things is impermanent, all attachments and clinging people have will cause them to suffer after the object of their attachment is gone.
He concluded that the step #3 is the reason for all of this. Your mind reacting to the senses with emotional response. You stop this process and you stop the source of all your misery.
And so, how do you do that? The method is very simple. As you sit down quietly and meditate, observe all the sensations within your body. They maybe pain and physical discomfort, itching, feelings of cold or heat, energy moving, pulsing, pleasurable feelings etc. Just observe without reacting to the sensations- if you feel itching, don’t scratch it. If you feel pain, observe it and move on. Realize, they all, just like other things are impermanent. You pains or pleasures or other sensations will be gone soon. So why giving importance to what is not real? If you learn to observe within our body more and more without dwelling of sensations, no matter how pleasurable they may be, you may soon be able to apply the same principle in your daily life. It’s a life-long process but the fruits of this type of practice are seen right away.
This is just the first step in cultivation, but without it all your efforts of growing as a human being may not be very successful. This method is also a very good start to emptiness meditation.January 25, 2006 at 10:14 am #10006
You know what? – feeling really miserable may seem awefull, it may feel confusing and frightening and as if there is no one else there for you, and perhaps all the spiritual knowledge you’ve accumulated seems worthless and meaningless in this state – but that’s the beauty of misery, it allows you to feel pain without any contraction and holding onto words and knowlege- you are free to feel without labeling shit. I recently had a discussion on how pain can guide humans to do fantastic things – things that are far greater than themselves, and somehow it all starts with misery.
Oysters only produce pearls when they are in pain – when there is an irritation inside they start building this beautiful protective shell around the irritant, but after a while the shell becomes far more than mere armour protecting the oyster from the pain – it becomes something that is very valuable and magical.
Just like oysters, the shamen of native cultures often became spiritual from some painfull moment in their life – whether surviving a deadly illness or losing parents, there was usually some extraordinary pain involved in igniting their inner spiritual drive. The misery motivated them and afforded them a special gift – one that most of the others had never felt before. Just feeling whatever pain that you felt, and allowing it to blossom, lets it flow through its course and finaly wilt away to be replaced by a very different feeling… Being able to feel something so powerfully and clearly allows you to let it go naturally and easily… most people attach their feelings to other people, words, thoughts… this only serves to further their illusions…
the misery that you felt let you know that you are now on the road to something greater.. didn’t you? You can feel optimistic now, knowing that the foundation for your own magnificent pearl has been built and your ability to feel the full spectrum of emotions has been reached giving you freedom to let those old feelings go, now you may start to feel things in their true form… and that does include feeling optimistic, calm and clear with this great drive pushing and helping you to create your own pearl.
Let us know how you feel… it’s important to share with others how you got over your sorrow – and even if you dont feel absolutely great now, by sharing your experiences here, you may find out how you can feel great as soon as you are ready.January 25, 2006 at 2:57 pm #10008
“In fact as I type there is no one there for me. I feel scarred and badly wounded, and trapped. nothing is light.. ”
How about reciting, aloud or silently, the mantras of Tara and the Medicine Buddha? (not exactly Taoist, I know).January 25, 2006 at 3:10 pm #10010January 25, 2006 at 5:35 pm #10012
I agree with freeform: Your misery can be a great opportunity.
Nietsche fiercely protected his misery!
Suffering is what really has driven the intensity of my practice, what has yielded the firmest, least self-deluding gains: Actual ability to change state through intent, to overcome errant patterns decisively. Suffering can also bring empathy, and clear seeing, without bullshit.
One of the most impressive communicators of spiritual systems and most accomplished spiritual adepts I am aware of, Julius Evola, was spurred into his career as a meditator following a suicide attempt, which stemmed from his experiences as an officer in the Italian army during the first world war. Buddhism, and later alchemy, became his ‘oxygen tube’, and also, eventually, his joy.
Develop your concentration–no single system or combination of spiritual or psychological philosophies can take the place of having good concentration, or will function fully without it. Good concentration leads to ability to control thought, to affect mood. If you aren’t also doing physical exercise regularly, start now. These two things are hard work, but hard work gives you something to get your mind off other crap, and leads to steady, objective accomplishment and health. Hard work is often the best thing to be doing. Steady, stubborn practice, a disciplined routine.
If you do qigong by very simply following the directions–and you must do the mental component, which develops concentration, otherwise it will not work anywhere near as well to quiet the mind and get energy flowing healthily–this can be very effective for changing your state, a magic bandaid. But you need to practce everyday and be concientious about following the directions, developing the skill straightforwardly and honestly–that will lead to definite results: Use your suffering to spur you on in this or in a similar practice that develops concentration.
SimonJanuary 25, 2006 at 6:51 pm #10014
wow.January 25, 2006 at 9:59 pm #10016
I spent many years feeling suicidal, thinking about various ways of killing myself. Never did try it…thankfully.
You’re in a tough spot because you need help, but your spiritual “healers” aren’t of help for you now, and most regular therapists won’t understand at all the spiritual side of this.
1. Stop doing all forms of chi kung and meditation and any active or goal oriented processes.
2. Remember things that have been good in your life. Treat these memories gently.
3. Find some simple things that feel good – some food? a walk on a favorite trail? some music?
4. Find someone to talk to, about anything, with whom you feel light.
5. Keep going, being gentle.
6. When things are on a bit of an even keel, start loving yourself with the inner smile. Gently. Allowing the smile to meet the other parts of you. Not trying to change them, just meeting them, this way allowing bits of smiling energy to be like stars dispersed through your body.
ChrisJanuary 26, 2006 at 12:14 am #10018
Some month’s back, on NPR (National Public Radio), I heard an interview with the author of Lincoln’s Melancholy. President Lincoln was a life long depresive, not just a little. He developed very conscious and deliberate strategies to promote positive slow progress. Though his melancholy didn’t ever entirely go away, he developed great courage and character in its company. There was some steadying courage that I found in hearing that .. that I can’t quite describe.January 26, 2006 at 7:46 pm #10020
does anyone has experince with this?January 27, 2006 at 10:51 am #10022
It is good, and should do you good. It is powerful, combining various components of the Kan and Li alchemies.
Chi kung forms will still act as another layer that you are putting on your distorted system. Best to be quiet for a while, before adding more.
ChrisJanuary 27, 2006 at 11:21 am #10024
I agree, during my darkest nights, years ago I withdraw from every ‘spiritual’ activity, and took time to digest and settle down.
I figured that earthly tasks helped me to stabilize all the intense changes my body/emotions went through. Digging any further will take you even further away from your center.January 27, 2006 at 11:35 am #10026
There was an interesting exchange a while back on the use of chi kung in dealing with serious physical illnes:
Deep Healing Chi Chi Kung was also mentoned positively in this thread though with the important warning that no medical claims can be made about it whatsoever:
P.S. Does anyone know how to put more than one hotlink in a message without using the form?January 28, 2006 at 2:33 pm #10028
I presume all of the good advice from others has given you pause and enough time to re-direct your life energy in a more positive, grounded direction.
Something to consider if you ever feel suicidal again. The illusion is that your suffering will
end if you end your physical body. It can seem like an act of free will, even courage, to end a bad life that seems impossible to transform.
But the physical body doesn’t generate or experience any suffering. That is the illusion. It is just a portal for the two halves of your soul. The yin and yang aspects (often referred to as Po and Hun) of your soul are creating the suffering because they are in disharmony.
But if you kill the body via suicide – and the body is really an innocent scapegoat here – it amounts to breaking the will of the Po (yin) soul, which is the aspect that desires to remain in the physical plane. It is in effect an attack on your free will, and on the free will of the life force and your greater soul that used its free will to incarnate you here.
Once you’ve died from suicide, the suffering intensifies greatly because the Po is now disconnected completely from its “heavenly”aspect, the Hun, and needs a body in order to integrate. But it doesn’t have a body. So your Po aspect becomes what is called a Hungry Ghost. You have all the same suffering, but with an even greater feeling of helplessness and LACK OF FREE WILL.
This attack on Free Will might seem to be a purely personal choice, nobody else’s business, since you are feeling all the suffering, whether here in the physical plane or in the low astral as a hungry ghost. But this is not the case.
You don’t really own your life yet. You belong to the collective of humanity. Only when you integrate your earthly and heavenly aspects can you claim right to permanent (eternal) being. Your soul pair is a temporary arrangement. If you fail to integrate, but do your best, and die naturally, its over and done with, “rental contract” is terminated.
But if you commit suicide, its like breaking a contract, and there are severe repercussions.
Your problem becomes the problem of your greater self, that vast cosmic intelligence that incarnated you here. Your using Free Will to attack your own right to exist here sends a killing vibration out to the Life Force at large, and especially to your Group or Oversoul. They now have to solve what you are unable to do: use your free will to find harmony in a difficult situation.
That healing process may be as simple as letting go of your old identity and thus patterns of conflict. Or it may involve finding someone else with enough skill to work below the surface.
But don’t be tempted by the evil thought that suicide solves your problem. that is a voice coming from aspects of life that want Life itself to fail. Don’t feed them with the blood of your body.
Honor the life force, it will help you find a way through.
michaelJanuary 29, 2006 at 3:41 am #10030
Doing dual cultivation is important too to prevent suicide!!!
Ricky from Singapore
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