Home › Forum Online Discussion › Philosophy › Stephen Hawking on parallel universes & ISSUE OF CHOICE
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July 1, 2006 at 7:03 pm #15313Michael WinnKeymaster
The significance of this article is show that the universe is processual, which is the core principle of Tao. It doesn’t have a fixed identity, and exhibits what I would call multiple timezones (not his language).
And that the process can include multiple universes that co-exist with this one, or possibly even universes/probabilities that simply fail to manifest because they don’t support some invisible impulse to evolve.In short, he is finding a plausible way for Quantum physics to become at least partially human-centric, i.e. the particles somehow CHOSE to evolve in a path that nurtured human life. He doesn’t use that language of “choice”, but it is implied by his supporting it teleologically (looking back).
My position has been that part of the evolution of humanity is to SHAPE the flow of the life force (=quantum field + INTELLIGENCE), that we don’t simply sit helplessly and watch while it unfolds according to some remote physical law.
Just think of the trillions of cellular decisions/perceptions made everyday/every moment within the micro-cosmos of our body-minds, and you begin to raise awareness of this shaping process. As within, so without.
michaelHAWKING REWRITES HISTORY… BACKWARDS
Nature
Friday, June 23, 2006http://www.nature.com/news/2006/060619/full/060619-6.html
http://www.thothweb.com/article3292.html
How did the Universe begin? Many scientists would regard this as one of the
most profound questions of all. But to Stephen Hawking, who has perhaps come
closer than anyone to answering it, the question doesn’t in fact even exist.Hawking, based at the University of Cambridge, UK, and his colleague Thomas
Hertog of the European Laboratory for Particle Physics at CERN in Geneva,
Switzerland, are about to publish a paper claiming that the Universe had no
unique beginning1. Instead, they argue, it began in just about every way
imaginable (and maybe some that aren’t).Out of this profusion of beginnings, the vast majority withered away without
leaving any real imprint on the Universe we know today. Only a tiny fraction
of them blended to make the current cosmos, Hawking and Hertog claim.That, they insist, is the only possible conclusion if we are to take quantum
physics seriously. “Quantum mechanics forbids a single history,” says
Hertog.The researchers’ theory comes in response to a problem raised by ‘string
theory’, one of the best hopes for a theory of everything. String theory
permits innumerable different kinds of universe, most of them very different
from the one we inhabit. Some physicists suspect that an unknown factor will
turn up that rules out most of these universes.But Hawking and Hertog say that the countless ‘alternative worlds’ of string
theory may actually have existed. We should picture the Universe in the
first instants of the Big Bang as a superposition of all these
possibilities, they say; like a projection of billions of movies played on
top of one another.It all adds up
This might sound odd, but it is precisely the view adopted by quantum
theory. Think of a particle of light reaching our eye from a lamp. Common
sense suggests that it simply travels in a straight line from the bulb to
the eye. But to make correct predictions about the particle’s behaviour,
quantum mechanics must consider all other possible paths too, including ones
in which, say, the photon bounces around the walls thousands of times before
reaching us.This summation of all paths, proposed in the 1960s by physicist Richard
Feynman and others, is the only way to explain some of the bizarre
properties of quantum particles, such as their apparent ability to be in two
places at once. The key point is that not all paths contribute equally to
the photon’s behaviour: the straight-line trajectory dominates over the
indirect ones.Hertog argues that the same must be true of the path through time that took
the Universe into its current state. We must regard it as a sum over all
possible histories.Take it from the top
He and Hawking call their theory ‘top-down’ cosmology, because instead of
looking for some fundamental set of initial physical laws under which our
Universe unfolded, it starts ‘at the top’, with what we see today, and works
backwards to see what the initial set of possibilities might have been. In
effect, says Hertog, the present ‘selects’ the past.Within just a few seconds after the Big Bang, a single history had already
come to dominate the Universe, he explains. So from the ‘classical’
viewpoint of big objects such as stars and galaxies, things happened only
one way after that point. Other ‘histories’, say, one in which the Earth
formed only 4,000 years ago, have made no significant contribution to this
cosmic evolution.But in the first instants of the Big Bang, there existed a superposition of
ever more different versions of the Universe, instead of a unique history.
And most crucially, Hertog says that “our current Universe has features
frozen in from this early quantum mixture”.In other words, some of these alternative histories have left their imprint
behind. This is why Hertog and Hawking insist that their ‘top-down’
cosmology is testable. Hertog says that the theory predicts the pattern of
the variations in intensity of microwave background radiation, the afterglow
of the Big Bang now imprinted on the sky, which reveal fluctuations in the
fireball of the nascent Universe. These variations are minute, but
space-based detectors have measured them ever more accurately over the past
several years.As the two researchers work out top-down cosmology in more detail, they hope
to be able to calculate the spectrum of these microwave fluctuations and
compare it with observations.The theory also suggests an answer to the puzzle of why some of the
‘constants of nature’ seem finely tuned to a value that allows life to
evolve. If we start from where we are now, it is obvious that the current
Universe must ‘select’ those histories that lead to these conditions.
Otherwise we simply wouldn’t be here.July 2, 2006 at 9:27 am #15314.freeform.Participant>>My position has been that part of the evolution of humanity is to SHAPE the flow of the life force (=quantum field + INTELLIGENCE), that we don’t simply sit helplessly and watch while it unfolds according to some remote physical law.<<
That's pretty much what I think – but with a slight variation… I think it's a little human-centric to think that 'we' are the ones shaping the 'Quantum Field' or the 'Hidden Variable'… In fact I think it is DNA. It's been arround a lot longer than we have, it completely reflects the universal structure (like the I Ching does) and it brought 'us' here along with all the other bits that keep 'us' alive… It's like the DNA finally decided that it needs to transform into a form that *can study itself* and that is what human conciousness really is…
it's that very small bit of attention that we have concious control over (we can only manage 5 to 9 'bits' of information at a time) but it means that we can use this to study ourselves and therefore our own DNA and this feedback loop is what's giving us the potential to evolve spiritually, create all the technology that we have and complexify our animal drives from marking territory with our excrement around our land to marking territory with ink on a piece of paper – to then arguing about the piece of paper and the ink and killing each other with our advanced technology.
(sorry for the mini rant – just saw a news story on the Israel – Palestine conflict)
July 2, 2006 at 3:55 pm #15316Alexander AlexisParticipant“it’s a little human-centric to think that ‘we’ are the ones shaping the ‘Quantum Field’ or the ‘Hidden Variable’… In fact I think it is DNA.”
I think that whatever form it’s in, human, dna, other being type -it’s still “Awareness” inside these structures that makes choices and shapes things.
“it’s that very small bit of attention that we have concious control over (we can only manage 5 to 9 ‘bits’ of information at a time)”
Perhaps if we are using only less than ten percent of our brain. (Which may be due to the fact that we are using only less than ten percent of our heart.)
Have you read a book called The Biology of Belief by biologist Bruce Lipton?
He is one of the forerunners of “the new biology” and is saying that the dna do not make the choices. They respond to the cell’s membrane which he says controls the whole party. The book is a clear statement contradicting the dna-determined viewpoint.
I really enjoyed this article. There have been several synchronicities very lately in my life, including a dream I had the night before Michael posted the article, which have been bringing my attention to the “fact” that our perception of how we are creating, and how the Universe is creating, is backwards, and that when we hold a new thought powerfully in the moment until it manifests that, as Seth, through Jane Roberts, said 35 years ago, we actually change what has happened in the past.
The idea that the current circumstances decide which pasts are “real” is a big step forward to living in the present and understanding the power of the present as the determining factor in creating reality. I can’t say I understand “how” it is possible for what Hawking says to be true (and would enjoy an explanation about that, if someone can swing it) but I sure can feel the sound-ness of it.
Alexander
July 2, 2006 at 6:40 pm #15318baguaParticipantI was watching a special on how the Sun was created and how it created the solar system and humanity, this theory includes a desrciption of Tao Alchemy and if we consiously follow the way the Sun was created and then creates and sustains life, this is “Shaping”. Energy spiralled to condense to create the sun and its energy is partly contained and partly dispersed to its creation, Individual and Collective, interacting at once.
Our alchemy mirrors this process, but possible humanity has the potental the Sun does not, to have an immortal condensation, where the Sun will burn out some time.
bagua
July 3, 2006 at 4:40 am #15320Michael WinnKeymasterBagua,
I think the Sun is teaching us/transmitting to us our immortality and our power to shape life as we internalize the solar logos (Way of Knowing) within ourselves. Even if the sun burns out someday, its spirit is imimortal and will take other incarnations if it so chooses, perhaps not in the physical. Remember, Sun is a star, and stellar mind controls the collective mind of the universe.AA reference to Lipton’s work is right on. I am not a fna of the DNA as god school. DNA is the medium of expressing and remembering our choices – its a form of jing/substance and thus involved in our will, but not the chooser of choice itself.
Lipton’s experiment was to remove the DNA from cells, and observe that they continued functioning. His conclusion is that DNA is needed to pattern the cell during its growth stage, but not sustain it. He decided there must be some other signal going to the cell, but wasn’t sure where it came from. I suggest science can’t detect the signal from subtle bodies yet.
m
July 4, 2006 at 4:53 am #15322wendyParticipantThe timing of your posting is perfect…it has shed some clear light, thanks
July 10, 2006 at 8:01 am #15324Michael WinnKeymasterNice piece, Max, thanks.
I especially like the piece about humans evolving from group animal consciousness and suppressing that tribal mind while we learned to individuate, and are re-integrating the individual and group consciousness. This is in alignment with my thesis about humans learning to mediate between the One (group mind) and the Many (individual minds), rather than just dissolving themselves into Oneness. This mediating function is exactly what immortality is about – mediation that continues to occur after death, in other dimensions as well as this one.
Scientists in this article give all the power for this to the DNA, which is understandable since that is all tht they can measure. But I think they are mistaking the message for the messenger.
I believe this ability to “shape” the chi field comes not from DNA, which like all matter is inherently inert until animated by some intelligence. This shaping power comes from deeper energetic levels of consciousness that are defined by Taoists as the five organ spiritis and the eight extra channels – the DNA is just the expression on the jing level that allows us to feel these expressions in body form. In other words, DNA is the step-down transmitter and language for our innate intelligence, it is not the intelligence itself. Basic shen-chii-jing relationship.
Expressing my DNA in a Brave New World,
MichaelJuly 10, 2006 at 1:01 pm #15326baguaParticipantHi Michael:
“This shaping power comes from deeper energetic levels of consciousness that are defined by Taoists as the five organ spiritis and the eight extra channels”
Do you mean the five organ spirits and eight extras are the vehicle that expresses the deeper levels of consciousness?
bagua
July 10, 2006 at 2:45 pm #15328DogParticipantYeah! thats what I was feeling. In regards to DNA. Man I got to get some glasses. I would have read maxs article but it was long and my eyes can take only so much.
“I especially like the piece about humans evolving from group animal consciousness and suppressing that tribal mind while we learned to individuate, and are re-integrating the individual and group consciousness.”
To me it seems we are still very tribal.
July 11, 2006 at 3:36 am #15330Alexander AlexisParticipantYes, it’s all about communication and relationship.
The tribal thing we do is a substitute for the sense of oneness we lost. Individuation at this depth calls for practices to reestablish the communication links. The “One” and the “Many” and the mediating between them is like the particle/wave idea. When in normal human perception, we see either one or the other. Immortality is the state of being able to transit fluidly between the two states because we no longer identify with separation.
-A
July 11, 2006 at 9:56 am #15332DylanParticipantI disagree with the notion that we were some kind of “undifferentiated horde” until human consciousness evolved. Tribal consciousness to my mind, is as much about individuality as it is about unity. Its individuality on a group level. This is why tribes clash and have continued to clash from the dawn of history, they struggle with each other for individuality, independance, identity etc.
Many animals behave individually too, look at Polar Bears, lone wolves etc. Differentiation didn’t come into existence with the human mind its always been here.
Its just that there has always been an underlying unity to that differentiation but this when fully realised, empowers and harmonises that sense of indivduality without wiping it out. Modern civilisation seems hell bent on either wiping out individualtity or enforcing separation and fragmentation – the two poles without the harmony between them.
Dylan
July 11, 2006 at 11:32 am #15334DogParticipant“The tribal thing we do is a substitute for the sense of oneness we lost.”
I have thought about it in that way as well. I believe it also has ties to survival. The older genrations having a built up ego and only realy accepting the younger generation if they agree with there reality. It is a scary thing for the young to feel that the ones they depend upon do not accept them.
July 11, 2006 at 12:20 pm #15336baguaParticipantThat is true if the older ones are unenlightned. As all of “us” age, we will set a different example and Qi field for the youger ones. Dont you agree?
bagua
July 11, 2006 at 1:45 pm #15338DogParticipant“That is true if the older ones are unenlightned.”
That is what I feel the context of the discussion was dealing with. So thats what I was talking about. Shure the work we do now to bring more light into this world could not do anything but help. But we must be mindfull of the differnce between ideas and ideals. Also our ego driven need to defend our reality.July 11, 2006 at 2:27 pm #15340Alexander AlexisParticipantDog-“our ego driven need to defend our reality.”
It’s this kind of thing that we are doing the practices to transmute. It’s the old lineage/genetic issues of fear and survival. We carry them around generation after generation until we decide to face them and change them. That’s where the alchemy comes in. But I believe that we had to learn “how to survive” because we lost our connection to the source and therefore our “protection.” We have been under that spell for so long that the momentum is difficult to break.
Dylan’s right about the good sides to tribalness, many of which are sorely lacking from our societies. But the wholesome stuff of family/tribe is different than the unconscious side of the “be like everyone else or we’re going to be scared of how you are different.” People perceive a threat to their existence when something changes (is not normal).
Dylan- “Its individuality on a group level. This is why tribes clash and have continued to clash from the dawn of history, they struggle with each other for individuality, independence, identity etc.”
I don’t agree that this is a healthy kind of individuality though. They struggle because they fail to see themselves in the other. That is the separation/duality viewpoint that comes from the extreme polarization we have experienced at this level of creation. Individuals do it and groups do it, but it is the same thing either way. The underdeveloped, immature, disconnected ego takes things as a threat to survival and sense of self and not as an enhancement to it.
Bagua- “As all of “us” age, we will set a different example and Qi field for the youger ones. Dont you agree?”
Yes, but it seems too that there is a wave of people coming in over the past couple decades that is bringing in this new consciousness and the changes in DNA. So I think it must be happening from both ends- older and younger.
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