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July 28, 2006 at 12:22 pm #15731.freeform.Participant
I agree – catharsis cannot be reached in an online forum. The pattern is – find inbalance in someone/something else (which is a reflection of an inbalance in you) then through discussion reach some kind of temporary balance in yourself. It’s great for feedback – you can discover a lot about yourself by doing this.
>>The draw I feel towards this place is much more like an addiction than anything positive.<>On the other hand, it it seems like no-one here talks about them anyhow.<>I’m off again. NN<<
Looking forward to your next re-lapse :0)
right – gotta get myself a haircut.
bye!July 28, 2006 at 12:39 pm #15733Yi TaoParticipantI am a part of Western Civilization. I am a student of Eastern Civilization. Both civilizations are valuable and insightful.
To dismiss justice as an abstract word that only creates division is to dismiss Western Civilization. I dismiss neither Eastern nor Western. I am a multi-verse unto myself.
The idea of justice first appears with Plato in “The Republic”. The dispute that first started between Socrates and Thrasymachus about justice is the same argument that we have today.
Is justice based on might or right? Is there universal truth or only the threat of the sword?
You asked:
“Is it really impossible for a tribe to exist without fighting, defending, being frightened?”Yes and no. It is possible for a tribe to live in relative peace as long as they are willing and able to defend themselves. (Armed Freedom) Those who are unwilling to defend themselves will be slaughtered. Those who are unable to defend themselves will be conquered. A tribe that is unwilling or unable to defend itself is either hiding behind a more powerful tribe or biding its time until its inevitable destruction. Anything else is wishful thinking and has never happened in the history of the world.
Taoism is great for the personal, but I’m not sure about the international. There is too much division in the world. While we can act to help unite the world, we can not pretend that it is already united.
I’ve reread the Tao Te Ching looking for insight into international affairs. I found one section that can I agree with.
—————————–
Weapons are the tools of violence;
all decent men detest them.Weapons are the tools of fear;
a decent man will avoid them
except in the direst necessity
and, if compelled, will use them
only with the utmost restraint.
Peace is his highest value.
If the peace has been shattered,
how can he be content?
His enemies are not demons,
but human beings like himself.
He doesn’t wish them personal harm.
Nor does he rejoice in victory.
How could he rejoice in victory
and delight in the slaughter of men?He enters a battle gravely,
with sorrow and with great compassion,
as if he were attending a funeral.July 28, 2006 at 2:10 pm #15735SheepyParticipantEx-supermodel Christie Brinkley’s 4th husband for cheating on her ass with (see image below)…
She is so hot! Open relationships are the way to go, marriage is stupid.
EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW
The beautiful teen lover of Christie Brinkley’s hubby yesterday revealed in sensational detail how the seamy spouse secretly seduced her by first playfully brushing up against her at work – then writing a saucy come-on note saying he lusted after her.
Diana Bianchi recalled how she met randy dad of two Peter Cook when she was a 17-year-old clerk at a tony Hamptons toy store – and how things quickly became sexual between the hot pair after he offered her a job at his architecture firm.
At first, “basically, he would slip in little comments and stuff,” said the now-19-year-old knockout, referring to how Cook would notice her appearance.
“He first physically made advances at me . . . probably around a month after I started working there . . . He just started being physically around me more and physically closer to me more,” Bianchi said in a stunning, 45-minute interview with The Post.
Bianchi – an aspiring singer from Southampton – couldn’t even bring herself to call her former lover by his first name yesterday.
She admitted that at the time Cook started putting the moves on her, she was “a little naive” and not “really thinking it’s like that.”
But the caddish Cook, 47, soon became bolder, suggestively rubbing up against her and touching her arm at times – while the pair worked together near a picture of his supermodel wife.
The panting hubby then laid all of his cards on the table.
“One time, I was standing at the desk, and he was doing something on, like, Microsoft Word, and he wrote, ‘How would you feel if I told you I was attracted to you?’ ” Bianchi, then 18, recalled.
“And I was like, ‘Uh, I dunno.’ I didn’t really answer him. I was kind of thinking, ‘Are you serious? Are you kidding?’ I really didn’t know what to do at that point.”
But the conniving Cook continued to aggressively woo her over the next few weeks, assuring her that his famous, 10-year marriage to supermodel Brinkley was already on the rocks.
“We started talking about things, and he was telling me that he was unhappy and that he was having problems at home,” Bianchi said.
They soon began sleeping together – although, she said, “We were not out dating [in public]. We didn’t do anything like that.”
Still, “I felt uncomfortable,” the teen admitted. “I had never been with anyone who was married. I was always on the right track. This was all new to me.”
Eventually, the strain of sneaking around with Cook got to be too much, Bianchi said, and she broke up with him in April.
“I just . . . it was uncomfortable for me,” the teen said with a heavy sigh.
Asked how Cook handled the breakup, Bianchi said, “I guess not well,” referring to his repeated attempts to woo her back with notes and phone calls, to no avail.
The Hamptons native said she has been “hearing that I’m not the first person that this was happening with,” noting that pals have told her Cook had trysts with other young women as well.
“I guess . . . there’s a lot of other girls in this position right now, and it’s not a good place to be,” Bianchi said.
“We were all tools of his little game, I guess,” the petite brunette said.
Bianchi said she now believes that Cook – despite the sweet words he whispered to her during their relationship – had been interested in getting only one thing from her: sex.
Bianchi spoke with The Post at the office of her high-powered lawyer, Joseph Tacopina.
Tacopina said he’s been hired in case Bianchi is called as a witness in what could end up being a bitter, $60 million divorce between the 52-year-old “Uptown Girl” Brinkley and Cook, her fourth husband.
But the dapper lawyer also is exploring the possibility of filing a civil suit against Cook.
Bianchi has “got a great sexual-harassment claim,” said Tacopina, who has teamed with expert sexual-harassment lawyer Rosemarie Arnold for the potential case. “He hired her to bed her. He used her, abused her.”
Cook, whose separation from Brinkley was announced by the model last week, did not return a call seeking comment yesterday.
Bianchi is the stepdaughter of Southampton Village Police Officer Brian Platt.
Platt confronted the amorous architect several times about having designs on his daughter and demanded that he stop, but Cook brushed him off.
Platt finally approached Brinkley at Southampton HS’s recent graduation, where she was speaking, and told her about the affair. The wronged wife soon confirmed the adultery through steamy e-mails that Cook and Bianchi had sent to each other.
Brinkley’s spokesman, Elliot Mintz, yesterday said, “To the best of my knowledge, I don’t believe Christine ever met the girl.”
Mintz also said Brinkley is “just a woman who at this moment is completely preoccupied with the protection of her children, trying to isolate them from all of this coverage, and trying to heal.”
She and Cook have two young kids: 8-year-old daughter Sailor Lee and Jack Paris, 10.
Standing barely 5 feet tall and dressed casually in a green polo shirt, knee-length jeans and sandals, Bianchi looks younger than her age.
Yesterday, she sported a green heart inked on her wrist that appeared to be a tattoo, but she said it actually was a pen drawing done by her little sister.
She was shy and nervous discussing the intimacy between her and Cook.
Bianchi said she first met Cook in the summer of 2004, while she was working in Stevenson’s Toys and Games on Jobs Lane in Southampton for $12 an hour.
Cook was there to buy toys for his two kids.
“He used to come in the store all the time when I was there,” Bianchi said. “I didn’t know how old he was at first.”
Although Cook made a point of speaking with her during each visit, Bianchi said she was oblivious to his apparent interest.
“I didn’t notice if he was [interested],” she said. “I never thought that he would be or that he should be.”
But her co-workers were more perceptive in noticing Cook’s eyes focusing on Bianchi.
“People around me were like, ‘Oh, he’s coming in here a lot.’ I didn’t really take it into consideration,” she said.
Bianchi left Stevenson’s when it closed for the sea son – and Cook soon made her an offer. He proposed that she come to work for him at his firm, Peter Cook Architect, on Elm Street in Southampton.
Bianchi joined the firm in the spring of 2005 to work on its Web site and to do “text for it and articles and office work and just basically whatever needed to be done.
“I needed the money, I needed a job,” she said.
“I had just moved out of my house, I was trying to do things on my own,” she said. “I didn’t want [my parents] to think I couldn’t do it on my own.”
Bianchi knew at the time that Cook was married to Brinkley – a still- striking blonde and at one time, the muse of her third husband, superstar singer Billy Joel.
A large photo of Brinkley and the children hung just above Bianchi’s desk in the office.
“It was alright at first, it was just typi cal,” Bianchi said of her job. “I didn’t have a problem working there.”
But when pressed on when she began reciprocating Cook’s advances, Bianchi paused.
“I don’t like these questions,” she said.
She then left Tacopina’s office to confer with the other lawyer, Arnold, for sev eral minutes.
Before she returned, Tacopina confirmed that Bianchi and Cook had a sexual relationship, which spanned about one year.
But the lawyer also said, “I’m just not going to let her” answer questions about how many times she slept with Cook, where it occurred and other circumstances of the trysts.
Still, Tacopina did say Cook began plying her with gifts of cash totaling up to $1,500 per month – on top of her eventually $50-per-hour salary – as well as paying for her new Nissan Maxima and “jewelry all the time.”
But the stress of having a personal relationship with Cook while working for him began to take its toll, Bianchi said, so she began working from home.
When she broke things off, Bianchi was living with her older sister in Bensonhurst in Brooklyn, and Cook “kept trying to get in touch with me. He kept e-mailing me and calling me.”
Cook would leave messages saying, “Call me. Are you OK? Please call me,” Bianchi said.
“And I wouldn’t call him back.”
Several times, Bianchi said, Cook drove to Bensonhurst to leave notes for her on her car, asking her to get in touch with him. But she refused to do so even though his desperation was apparent “if he was going to drive all the way to Bensonhurst.”
“I guess he was disappointed,” she said.
July 28, 2006 at 3:32 pm #15737Alexander AlexisParticipantPlato, Why have you posted this?
-Alexander
July 28, 2006 at 3:57 pm #15739JernejParticipantwinn won argument not by rightessness, but by of evoking plea of humanity
humane affairs are versatile
July 28, 2006 at 4:19 pm #15741NnonnthParticipant>>however it is my experience that most jews will stick together and defend israel no matter what. you must know damn well that’s true.<<
I am claiming, from direct experience of my Jewish family, the exact opposite. Produce your evidence please. NN
July 28, 2006 at 4:26 pm #15743NnonnthParticipantThis:
>>the difference is not jews vs goim but honest decent courageous independent lonely bums versus brain washed dumb fuck masses ruled by a few nasty scoundrels<<
Is precisely my point which you appear to agree with. (sigh) see post to Freeform earlier NN
July 28, 2006 at 6:00 pm #15745SheepyParticipantBecause I am having a good time in Florida right now. That IS NOT shit, BTW…
July 28, 2006 at 11:43 pm #15747matblackParticipantnn >>it seems no-one has a good word to say about anyone else on this site, and everyone’s first assumption is that the other person hasn’t got a clue and is only one step away from being part of the problem. <>Why on a site dedicated to freeflowing energy and ease is everyone so very pissed off and difficult?<<
everyone? everyone?, don't let what you see as a general negative curent at times blind you from the positive flow and friendly vibes that still exist on this forum from time to time.
mate, not all of us are difficult, arrogant or conflict driven.
July 29, 2006 at 1:31 am #15749Alexander AlexisParticipantJuly 29, 2006 at 7:20 am #15751NnonnthParticipant>>mate, not all of us are difficult, arrogant or conflict driven.<<
You're right. I'm sorry if that seemed insulting. I'm doing what Paolino's doing, tarring things with a massive brush.
My impressions of this board have been gathered over a period of time, but there have been long breaks in between visits. It's just that, hell with it, I really appreciate places like this. Thanks to the net we have the possibility of a new Alexandria here, a place where *whatever* their influences, traditions, practices, beliefs and even locations, people can talk. That's what Alexandria was at the time of 'Christ'. (That's what Baghdad was once too… and look at it now.) It's always this, historically, to me, that makes the possibility of true progress, true manifestation of wisdom in the world. People come along and try to end oases like these. Then they dry up.
Just stop for a second and realise how lucky we are to be able to talk like this!
We have a here an amazing number of localities and points of view. Our esteemed host went from kundalini yoga to taoism, but he knows about magic too. Look at Freeform for heaven's sake, with his incredibly wide-ranging studies. Jernej and Wendy, too… all different, all unique… precious! That's how I see it. Everyone here is a real searcher, and here is a place where they can, as it says, share their way.
My feeling is that this hybrid vigour is more important than what I often see flaring up here, which is sectarianism of one form or another – not only more important, dammit, more beautiful, more precious and just plain more *interesting*! At the moment it's Paolino re the Jews. Often it has been taoists vs. buddhists. Once it was a satanist. It seems to happen with great regularity that someone decides a simple you v. me is more interesting than a broad gathering of interesting individuals. Then they blow everything out of proportion.
Paolino's rants really depress me because someone who is wise enough to understand that all of the bullshit the media feeds people is indeed bullshit should be able to see through any form of sectarianism and groupmindedness. The world doesn't consist of groups of people only, but of people pure and simple.
In my life things are not as Paolino would have them. For example I just made a friend who is Jewish – she is about to go up to Oxford. Her degree was on the terrorist use of female suicide bombers, comparing Palestine with Northern Ireland. She is also a bellydancer which is how we met her, she dances in arab clubs, wherever. Her dad is a high dan in several martial arts and does qigong. He is also a rabbi.
Are these people automatons supporting Israel? Or are they completely unengaged? Do they belong to these nice and easy categories that Paolino has decided describe the world? No they don't, because the categories don't exist. If you are alone in your bedroom miserably lamenting the needless death of children at the hands of ignorant and pigheaded thugs, you might by wishful thinking prefer the categories to reality. But here! Here is *the* very place in the world, a place under the auspices of a truly universal alchemy, descended from Great Sages of Taoism – *the* very place, where to descend to the drivel of ghettoist rhetoric is least to be expected and least to be tolerated.
The world I live in is a world where everyone is unique. You cannot say 'jewish', 'taoist', etc., cannot say one word, and say anything important about a person. You have to see their hearts. And the spectacular variety of viewpoints that come together here tends to confirm that. It makes me happy to see all these people, all trying their damnedest to figure it out and do what's right and talk with each other. I cannot understand why some people are tempted to drift towards a divisiveness that would ruin what has the potential to redeem this time – the ability of different people to recognise their commonness.
I'm NOT going to harp on it, but the things Paolino said were very common to say in the thirties in Germany. And the idea of finding some kind of 'solution' to the 'Jewish question' has for someone like me a most miserably ominous ring to it. I don't intend to argue about how big the holocaust was, but anyone who believes the world actually gains from such *thinking* is so far from understanding where the good is that (pace Freeform, who says Paolino's heart is big) there can be nothing constructive coming from them.
I myself am purely Jewish blood, both sides, and have two sisters who are of course the same. I am what is called a 'Cohen' – can trace my genetics back to one of the twelve tribes in other words. I also have never read the bible right through. I find it rather dull and completely irrelevant. I was tutored for my Bar Mitzvah by an orthodox jew, who then wouldn't come to see the event because the rabbi of my synagogue also had a civilised and tolerant view and was not hardline enough for him. He came to my house to congratulate me afterwards, but wouldn't even drink a glass of water, I guess because our cups were not sufficiently kosher for him. I thought and still think he is a fool, but more importantly his behaviour was about divisiveness. I did not think that 'god' (in whom I do not believe now) had commanded this divisiveness and ever since then I believe that inclusiveness is the key.
So I have been puzzled by Jewish questions all my life, am still investigating what 'Jewishness' really means, and as for the attitudes of west bank settlers or israeli right wingers, they are so far from anything I could consider 'myself' that I have nothing in common whatever with them, nor does anyone I know and love. Paolino lumps me in with them and insists all jews hang together automatically… he understands nothing about reality. And this place is for learning about reality.
I married a Chinese lady who was raised Catholic in the Phillipines and who I met in Canada. My middle sister married a guy from New York whose family is Irish Catholic. My youngest sister is currently saving monkeys in Guatemala in between bouts of working with mayan shamans.
This is the world I live in, a world where many people are a little puzzled and are doing their damnedest to heal from, and understand the truths behind, the rants and the stupidity. That's true of everyone I know, race or religion (or even whether they practice any form of spirituality) aside.
Why not make this place an Alexandria? A place where, after all the incredible divisiveness and ignorance of the common media has been endured for yet another day, people can come and breathe a sigh of relief that here, anyway, is intelligence and civilization? If people here like this place for that reason, why not respect that 'registration privilege' a little more? Why are there still so many posts that indeed are 'obscene, prejudicial, irrelevant, inflammatory, or falsely impersonating others'? After all, whatever the solution is to some putative (and in my opinion completely non-existent) 'Jewish Question', or to any other question, it is not made into more of a solution by shouting it louder.
I think it is in the hands of the members of this board to make it something special, respect it, and use it to further understand the nature of this world.
NN
July 29, 2006 at 8:41 am #15753wendyParticipantYesterday, I felt it was Babylon, people were trying to ‘talk’ but seemingly not heard like it was meant (including myself). That is the problem with cyber world.
Today I feel happy with your posting, heartful because of your words, now there is better understanding…. Yes this is a place were we can talk ‘freely’ without fear about our most inner feelings and ideas, testing them, asking for feedback, taking these feedbacks and ideas into our most sacred inner chambers and chew them. I feel I live pretty isolated from ‘others’ and this forum is my window to the world. A place were I can ‘be’ without judgement (although judgements are all over here as well, but nevertheless from a different angle and sometimes very usefull).
For that reason I am happy this discussion was not erased because the subject on ‘Jews’ is a very heavy one, and one that is so often ‘not talked’ about. I am very happy you joined it and happy it was allowed to unfold, happy you came back in this threat with more peace and heartful energy…There is a lot of heartful energy between the unknown solitary seekers and the fact that even the most tormented seekers are still allowed here is speaking for the openness and generosity of the host. That he is cutting the weed in some occassions, that is the task of a good father. Even the most difficult children have the right of being listened to, have need of love and appreciation. That is the only path for true healing, as we all very well know.
Yesterday while wandering in Babylons corridors there was no hope, anger and misunderstanding, today I see the mingling colors and flavors of Alexandria…yet we should rename Alexandria, Alexander the Great was a conquerer not a lover, he did great harm during his queste. A new dawn, a new name…
July 29, 2006 at 9:16 am #15755NnonnthParticipant>>There is a lot of heartful energy between the unknown solitary seekers and the fact that even the most tormented seekers are still allowed here is speaking for the openness and generosity of the host.<<
You're quite right.
I also sometimes feel isolated… I think the media wants people like us to feel isolated, which makes it all the more important that no-one succumb to loneliness and anger… I do wish of course that someone like Paolino could realise that it IS loneliness and anger, in other words unintegrated feelings, that he is dealing with – rather than any kind of understanding how to save the world! I do feel bound to respond when these things are written – but I guess I will have to do better not be hurt and inflammatory in my turn.
You're right also that the net seems to bring these feelings up in me – I don't get them talking to people in real life. The net is perhaps, in taoist language, the least body-centred place, too mental.
NN
July 29, 2006 at 2:10 pm #15757.freeform.ParticipantI agree with you on one thing – if someone punches me – I’m gonna block/punch back. But I dont think this discussion is about that. What interests me here is how societies work – and your description of Armed Freedom points to a very much Patrist form of society. Armed Freedom goes hand in hand with all the other things that a Patrist society upholds. However a Patrist society is not the only way (as you seem to think). You can also have a Matrist society – the yin to the Patrist yang.
We live in a world where we are becoming one big tribe rather than a collection of tribes. I know it seems ridiculous to think that – with all the conflicts going on now – but here you are reading posts from people all over the world. Things are changing and we have to decide which direction to take.
G. Rattray Taylor studied the different forms of society and provided a comprehensive list detailing the differences between the two types of society:
Patrist:
1)Restrictive attitude towards sex.
2)Limitation of freedom for women
3)women seen as inferior, sinful
4)Chastity more valued than welfare
5)Politically authoritarian
6)Conservative – against innovation
7)Distrust of research/inquiry
8)Inhibition, fear of spontineity
9)Deep fear of homosexuality
10)Sex differences maximised (dress)
11)Asceticism, fear of pleasure
12)Father-religionMatrist:
1)Permissive attitude towards sex
2)Freedom for women
3)Women accorded high status
4)Welfare more valued than chastity
5)Politically democratic
6)Progressive – revolutionary
7)No distrust of research
8)Spontaneity – exhibition
9)Deep fear of incest
10)Sex differences minimized (dress)
11)Hedonism, pleasure welcomed
12)Mother-religionFrom this list we can see that our (western) society has slowly been moving towards the Matrist end of the scale – but ofcourse the current political climate (Bush administration) seems to be supporting the values of the Patrist society. Evangelical Christianity is the supporting Father-religion – and ‘Armed Freedom’ is the supporting, political ‘style’.
It’s interesting how this duality is also present in other mamals – the bonobos and the chimps. Chimps are Patrist – their society is ruled by an Alpha Male, and everyone is controlled through the domination/submission duality. Bonobos are Matrist – the society revolves around the women and is mediated by constant sexual behaviour (rather than fear).
so do you want to be a lover or a fighter?
personally I think there is a middle ground – the duality is just two sides of the same coin – when we (collectively) see the coin as a whole – maybe then a major paradigm shift will happen…
July 29, 2006 at 2:35 pm #15759NnonnthParticipantOK Paulino –
>>Hey why are you telling us that the world dont consists of clear cut groups, why dont you go tell the israelis or the zionist supremacists who have occupied MY government and whose sole allegiance is to fucking israel and who ship 3 billion dollars yearly to israel while i and million american fellows dont even have health insurance to go see a doctor?<>you know what? you claim that you are not like them yet you make it clear at each and every sentence that you are a jew. it happens to me all the time, when i meet someone and start talking carelessly they go, look i am a jew! who the fuck asked them in the first place!<>you mentioned germany in the 30’s , well here to keep up the scholarly tone of my harangues to use Winn’s lingo, here’s an interesting piece for your cultural enrichment and understanding of the jewish situation and the mindset of the jewish oligarchy (and how much they give a shit about you):
Here’s who REALLY started WWII:
http://www.wintersonnenwende.com//scriptorium/english/archives/articles/jdecwar.html<>Point is, i started this as an objection to israel burning children and civilians alive with phosphorous bombs.<>you claim that you disagree with israle yet i was accusing israel and now you are accusing me – a negation of a negation ia an affirmation<>sure your dialectical skills are more subtle than thelerner’s or the fukin adl shitheads but there we go again the same purpose being attempted to discredit one who objects to israel’s crimes.<<
I object in the strongest possible terms to the invasion of Lebanon. Also to the invasion of Iraq. I object to the actions of the Burmese government. I object to the slaughter in Rwanda. I do not like many if any of the governments on this planet.
But your posts were about more than that. They were about the nature of the 'Jewish question'. I do not think that Israel's current government represents Judaism, even if I cared about Judaism, which I don't. Nor do I think that any of the big religions on this planet is doing the kind of unmixed good that they might like us to believe.
But you seem to think the whole thing is just a 'jewish problem'. If you think it is only that, you are sailing perilously close to madness. Jews are still human beings, and it is a human problem, the problem of misuse of power, the problem of ego, the problem of not being able to speak, one human being to another, in a civilized and respectful manner. Ultimately it is thus the problem of perceived *difference*, and its resolution – rather than divisiveness.
So I am not in the least trying to discredit either you, nor your stance on Israel which I share completely. I object in the most strenuous manner possible to any suggestion that a one-dimensionally 'racial' or 'religious' perspective can be taken on such problems and claimed to 'solve' them at one angry fell swoop. The problems are not racial primarily nor religious primarily – they are primarily human. Human problems can be solved only by patiently understanding the nature of human beings. This is precisely what a board like this is for. Thus I cannot condone martial and inflammatory language as a 'solution' to evil, especially not here, any more than I can condone it when it is used by the people who are at present in power.
Have I made myself any clearer?
NN
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